Masterclass on Trademarks with Trademark Angel’s CEO Anita Mar

Episode 217

Join the conversation with Anita Mar, the remarkable CEO of Trademark Angel, as she shares her captivating journey from Israel to the helm of a leading trademark service company. With 25 years of rich experience, Anita offers a treasure trove of knowledge on the essentials of trademarks for e-commerce sellers, the power of brand identity, and the nuances of navigating Amazon’s Brand Registry. Her insights are an invaluable compass for any entrepreneur steering their brand through the bustling marketplace of online retail.

Unlock the secrets to choosing a standout trademark name, understanding the importance of category selection, and avoiding the pitfalls of legal disputes with similar brands. Our chat with Anita illuminates the complexities of the trademark registration process and offers strategic advice on how to expedite your brand registry. The challenges of opposition periods and the benefits of filing for a trademark in various regions are demystified, equipping listeners with the savvy needed to protect their brand on a global scale.

Anita’s expertise isn’t all we unpack; we also explore the unique value Trademark Angel brings to the table. The company’s commitment to client success, comprehensive services, and conservative approach ensures a high chance of registrability for your trademark. By the end of our session, you’ll know exactly how to reach out to Trademark Angel to secure the trademark your brand deserves and be armed with entrepreneurial wisdom that goes beyond the trademark talk.

How can the guests contact?  website, email, social?

https://trademarkangel.com/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/anitamar/

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00;00;24;04 – 00;00;45;22
Unknown
Welcome, everyone to the Firing Demand podcast. On today’s episode, we have the privilege to interview Anita Mark. Anita is a registered trademark agent and CEO of Trademark Angel. Anita has 25 years of experience working with trademarks in 2017. Anita founded Trademark Angel and now has a staff of over 20 employees who provide trademark services in the U.S. as well as internationally.

00;00;45;22 – 00;01;06;28
Unknown
Trademark Angel’s mission is to make trade marketing affordable for everyone, including startups, without compromising quality. Welcome to the show, Anita. Thank you. Hello, Ken. And hello, David. I know you’re not here, but hello anyway. Yes. Why do you mention 25 years? Yeah. For a moment I felt very sad because it said a lot of years, but they are doing pretty much the same thing.

00;01;06;28 – 00;01;24;06
Unknown
But I don’t regret it. It’s been fun, and it’s. It’s very exciting to see the very exciting field. I love what I do. So, yeah, I’ll be happy to answer any questions you may have. I’ve been running Trademark Angel for six years now, so it’s been six and a half years. You know, when you say 25 years, it’s.

00;01;24;06 – 00;01;43;15
Unknown
I feel that an experience, you know, that’s how you get to be an expert is just doing doing something for so long. And so now you’re an expert at that. So that’s a really good thing. I think it was just a coincidence, really, because I didn’t plan to work in trademarks. I was just a coincidence. But it was a lucky coincidence because I don’t know what else I would rather do, you know.

00;01;43;15 – 00;02;04;08
Unknown
So speaking on that, can you share with the audience kind of a little bit about your background and your journey into becoming an expert? What trademarks? I actually started working as a trademark paralegal when I lived in Israel, found an ad in a newspaper that, like the U.S. trademark attorney, was looking for a trademark paralegal. And at that time I didn’t know what Attorney Mantell what trademark meant.

00;02;04;08 – 00;02;20;29
Unknown
So I looked it up and quickly applied. Called means that can account for an interview. And I said, Why? And he said, like in an hour. And I lived in a different city. So I quickly hopped on the plane or not in the plane on a train. And I came. He just hired me on the spot because his current paralegal decided to go to the U.S. He had no one.

00;02;21;00 – 00;02;42;23
Unknown
So that’s how it happened. And ever since, I just I just I just logged it because I was while I was planning to become an economist, I finished well, I had a degree in economics, which is pretty useless because I didn’t know how to apply it. So it was just a like a coincidence. And after that, I immigrated to Canada in 2004 and I was I worked in a large law firm.

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00;02;42;23 – 00;03;01;00
Unknown
I worked there for seven years, and then I sat for the trademark agent exam in 2007. And I got the highest mark in Canada in the trademark agent exam because I over studied, I was so afraid I would fail. I studied for two years nonstop, pretty much knew everything, all the case law, all the rules. Yeah, it was great.

00;03;01;00 – 00;03;18;23
Unknown
But then, of course, you you forget the details, like exact details, but the framework stays with you. But yes, it’s been fun. And I left this big company when I had my second baby. I went on the mat leave and that I found a job online. Well, not online, but with a small company. And I worked from home.

00;03;18;23 – 00;03;34;23
Unknown
And when I had my third baby, I decided that it was time to open my own company because I could do that. I was just. I just needed this extra push. And I think my last baby provided that. Yes, I wasn’t afraid anymore because before I was afraid it wouldn’t work, that I wouldn’t succeed. That is just too scary.

00;03;34;23 – 00;03;51;08
Unknown
Like where will I find clients? What if it doesn’t work? What if I have no one to ask but a district out? Fortunately, Yes, it did. And now you have a staff of over 20 employees and you guys are guys and girls. And you guys are providing trademark services all over the world, which is which is really impressive.

00;03;51;08 – 00;04;19;11
Unknown
So, Anita, the listeners to the show, we have advanced sellers in e-commerce, we have some intermediate sellers. We also have some some people listening that they want to start a business, but they haven’t yet and they’re just kind of researching and listening and following along. And so to kick off the show, can you give the listeners kind of an overview on IP basically, you know, trademarks, copyright and patents and kind of maybe a 32nd snapshot on each and what is right for e-commerce sellers to focus on out of those.

00;04;19;11 – 00;04;37;07
Unknown
Yeah. So basically all three of them are like parts of intellectual property, but people get them confused all the time. Like we get a call from a client or can they trademark my copyright or can they My trademark and my brain just explodes when I hear that. Well, yeah, people just get confused. So basically a trademark is the same as a brand.

00;04;37;07 – 00;04;55;05
Unknown
So that’s like what you call your brand, basically the name for your product or your service. Sometimes it’s the same as your company name. So this is where also people get confused. They don’t understand it’s the same as the company name or different. The company name can be your brand, that can be your trademark. If it’s what you put on your products when you sell your products.

00;04;55;05 – 00;05;14;15
Unknown
So basically a trademark is a shortcut to your products without having to remember your company name because your company and they may have two deep or limited global like whatever at the end that makes the brand longer and more difficult to remember. A trademark is just a shortcut. That’s how your customers find you. That’s how they know who to buy from.

00;05;14;15 – 00;05;33;28
Unknown
So it’s just a source indicator. In short, like your customers see your like for example, your packaging or your product and they know, okay, that’s the company that I like buy from. I will buy these products because I know them a patent protection invention, like, for example, a new engine, or it can protect an improvement to an existing invention.

00;05;33;29 – 00;05;56;29
Unknown
Most patterns nowadays are improvements of existing inventions. Even Thomas Edison’s most famous invention of a light bulb wasn’t in the original invention, but it was rather in the improvement of an existing light bulb. So most of the patents today are just improvements to what already exist Copyright, protect, original and literally or artistic works. Like, for example, songs, music plays, books on them drops.

00;05;57;00 – 00;06;17;01
Unknown
That’s important for Amazon sellers. Copyrights and patents expire so they don’t last. But the protection doesn’t last forever. For example, patents on the last for 20 years. And after that anyone can use the invention. Copyright lasts for the life of the author. Plus, 70 years after death in Canada lost 50 years, but trademarks do not expire. That’s the cool thing about them.

00;06;17;02 – 00;06;33;28
Unknown
The longer you own your trademark, the more valuable it becomes. How much is Coca-Cola worth would have? No, that’s pretty much all about the name. It’s all about the goodwill. So the longer it takes, the longer you keep your trademark, the more it costs. So and you can renew its travel. So every ten years you renew your trademark and you have it.

00;06;33;28 – 00;06;51;15
Unknown
I mean, it will not expire. So that’s basically the the difference. And in short, about them, thanks for explaining those. And yeah, I did not know the the copyrights you know not expiring the trademarks you can kind of renew them and yeah they gain value over time because the longer you hold them, the more brand recognition you have.

00;06;51;15 – 00;07;15;16
Unknown
So that’s pretty cool. Along with the theme of, you know, we have some advanced sellers, intermediate sellers and some and some sellers are just getting started or are thinking about starting, you know, Amazon is in the US as well, believe it’s 80% of all e-commerce is done on Amazon. And so Amazon has a program called Amazon Brand Registry that protects sellers and it gives sellers access to a lot of other features and functions with an Amazon.

00;07;15;16 – 00;07;35;05
Unknown
And so there’s there’s a piece of this that you need a trademark to get in there. And so can you kind of explain the Amazon brand registry and how that trademark, you know, how to get a trademark and be work with Amazon and that program? Yes, yes, yes. We actually work a lot with Amazon sellers. Both of our clients sell on Amazon or Shopify Walmart.

00;07;35;08 – 00;07;59;08
Unknown
So just like Trademarks, Office has their own database of file trademarks and registered trademarks. Amazon also has their own well database where you can enroll if you file a trademark. So if you file a trademark, like for example, in the U.S. or in another country, you can enroll in Amazon’s brand registry. So it’s basically it’s just like an internal database of brands that they recognize for their own purposes.

00;07;59;08 – 00;08;21;10
Unknown
And once you enroll in Amazon’s brand registry, you get like a few perks thank leave. Right now, it’s almost a prerequisite. You can’t sell it without having access to brand registry or I think my my kids were six. I think I’d catch it, you know. Yeah. What it gives you. I think the most important thing is what you get is you get access to your own, like online store so you can have your own store.

00;08;21;10 – 00;08;37;27
Unknown
So when people click on the brand name, so it says brand and on and the name or brand that you click there and you go to a store where you can see the sellers are the product. If there is no brand registry, when you click on brand, you go to like a collection of random listings from other sellers.

00;08;37;27 – 00;08;57;10
Unknown
So you can be or you can go somewhere else and shop and buy from somebody else. But you find the brand by this tree. You have your own store that you can customize. It can make it pretty for each individual listing. You can also have you can add videos, you can include additional bullet points, you can include additional photographs, the brand registry.

00;08;57;11 – 00;09;20;03
Unknown
You can have access to brand registry with the filed trademark. So when you filed your trademark in the U.S., you can get access to the brand registry. When your trademark is fully registered, you will be able to remove hijackers. So you get additional benefit so you can report a violation. So there is a hijack on your listing and you can remove them, but you don’t have this benefit of just after filing because the trademark office have has not checked you.

00;09;20;03 – 00;09;40;21
Unknown
Yeah. So you just applied. It’s just a filed trademark. A lot of people get confused and they say, I just need brand badges too. But like do do need access to the brand registry or do you want to have the ability to remove hijackers if there are any? Because it’s a big problem. As you may know, you get hijackers, they bring the price down, they get the buy box, lose sales, and it’s a huge problem.

00;09;40;21 – 00;09;57;21
Unknown
So if you decide to file your trademark after you got the hijack on your listing, it’s too late because you will not be able to remove them until your trademark is registered. It’s a really cool tool, but it’s it’s an even cooler tool when your trademark is registered. But even without registration, once you’re in the brand registry, you will not have so many hijackers.

00;09;57;21 – 00;10;17;12
Unknown
Usually they check if like a client, while the seller is in the brand registry by clicking on the name. If there is a store means you end the brand registry, but there is no store. Okay, it’s an easy catch, easy prey. You can, you know, attach to his listing cell from this listing and they will not be able to remove you also when you want, you can also get access to with the registry trademark.

00;10;17;12 – 00;10;35;09
Unknown
You can get access to a transparency program that’s like another program that Amazon has. It’s a cool program and you can get access to this program with the registered trademarks. So if you need access to transparency program quickly, it’s best to file in Germany because Germany is extremely quick and you can get a trademark registered in two weeks.

00;10;35;13 – 00;10;51;11
Unknown
So and they accept a registered trademarks from any country for their transparency. Yeah but because if you need if you if you wait until you’re U.S. trademark register that can be 18 months. Yeah. There’s a couple of things that you mentioned there. Thanks for describing that program. And there’s a couple of things that you mentioned in there that I want to highlight.

00;10;51;11 – 00;11;09;00
Unknown
You know, filing for a trademark is different thing than having a registered trademark. And so filing for the trademark, you know, whether you use IP accelerator program with an Amazon or however you get a trademark filed, it’ll give you access to all the features that you kind of explained. Amazon Brand Registry, your storefronts, all of that brand portals.

00;11;09;00 – 00;11;27;29
Unknown
And then you can you have access to to look and see who’s hijacking your listings. But until your trademark is registered, you cannot enforce it. They just because you need a registered number to enforce that policy, which is sometimes confusing to people, Hey, I’ve registered from a trademark and I can’t get these hijackers on. Well, it has to have registered for it for them to do that.

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00;11;27;29 – 00;11;47;26
Unknown
And so interesting stuff. So moving on. Let’s say someone started a business last year. They have their business entity, they have their website, they’ve got everything set up and running. Should they still worry about a trademark even after they have their store, their store going? That’s another place for confusion. They’ll often tell us, I have a domain name or I have my company already registered.

00;11;47;26 – 00;12;09;18
Unknown
Like, isn’t that enough? I mean, do I still need to file like what is a domain name? Really? It’s just an address that one uses to visit a website. It’s more and more a domain name registration is not the same as trademark registration. Registration A domain name alone doesn’t give business owners like any trademark rights at all, like in the U.S., Canada, like many other countries, trademark rights are based on use.

00;12;09;18 – 00;12;28;10
Unknown
And simply having a domain name doesn’t mean that they actually use a trademark in the legal sense, because you have a domain even if you have a website that shows some products unless you sell them, there are no trade. McBride’s really it may seem simple, but in the trademark sense, trademark use is more complicated that than you think.

00;12;28;10 – 00;12;48;21
Unknown
So it’s not just, okay, I put the trademark name on the website. Is it enough? It’s not enough. You actually need to sell your product to qualify for trademark use, at least in the U.S. if you register like when you buy just a domain name, like you don’t create trademark rights, just buy by destroying the domain name because like, it doesn’t connect to the specific products and services.

00;12;48;24 – 00;13;08;13
Unknown
As I said, it’s just like an address, like a domain name itself doesn’t sell any product and doesn’t offer any services. So when you buy just a business name like or a company name like that give you a trademark rights? No, because the business name is simply that. It’s just the name. It’s just the name. It’s it’s a way to identify a business.

00;13;08;14 – 00;13;26;10
Unknown
CO Like an entity, like to individual or doing business. AS And in the US, the business name is limited to the state. The business name doesn’t need to be different from business names and out of state. But when you filed trademark, it’s central in the U.S. and it’s also federal in Canada, so it’s not limited to a particular state, a province.

00;13;26;13 – 00;13;56;19
Unknown
So when you what’s interesting is you cannot register your like corporation or LLC like M check Saddam. And you you may think that it’s safe to trademark then you’ve been checked. But actually those databases don’t talk. I mean, the corporate database and the trademark office database, are they completely separate and they’re not linked to each other? You may have incorporated and you you may have thought about the name that you like and you have incorporated, and then you come to us, you want to register that name as a trademark and we check and it may not be available.

00;13;56;19 – 00;14;16;01
Unknown
So this is where it’s best to maybe either do it, do it simultaneously, or maybe first do the clearance check clearance search for a trademark name in the trademark office database, and then registered that name as the company name, if that’s what you want. If you want the trademark name of the corporation name LLC name to be the same as otherwise, you may end up with different names.

00;14;16;01 – 00;14;33;24
Unknown
I mean, it’s not a problem really, but some people are really set on having the same name for their corporation domain and trademark, and it’s best if it’s the same. Brilliant. I like simple. I like keeping everything simple and all the same. That kind of brings me into the next question is when is what is your recommendation of when to file a trademark?

00;14;33;24 – 00;14;51;17
Unknown
Because you kind of just hit on a little bit about, you know, the name. The database is don’t talk. That was that’s important. Right? And so registering your business name in a trademark, those databases don’t talk. And so are you recommending that owners file for the trademark about the same time they file for their business name or. Yes.

00;14;51;17 – 00;15;11;18
Unknown
So that’s a good question. I mean, there is a point when it’s too early to file and there is a point when it may be too late to file. I mean, the idea that you should file for trademark registration as soon as you have like as soon as you have realized that this name is important to you and that you don’t want anyone else to steal it, many companies decide to see how the business is going to go.

00;15;11;18 – 00;15;28;14
Unknown
They don’t want to file immediately. They want to just just wait and see. And as a result, they lose time because by the time they decide to trademark their brand, a few years later, somebody else you know already, that may be too late because there is no legal requirement for you to file a trademark, but it does make sense to do so.

00;15;28;15 – 00;15;49;20
Unknown
Yes, I did. Like the sequence should be like this. You keep up a few names that you like. You go to name, check name, then see HK dot com and you check to make sure the social media names available like Facebook, YouTube, like Twitter, Instagram, like whatever else you may need to take those names immediately. Then you check the domain name to make sure it’s available.

00;15;49;21 – 00;16;04;25
Unknown
If you see it’s available, you buy it. I mean, that’s really cheap, so get it immediately. Don’t wait. Because what I noticed is when you check a certain domain name and you don’t buy, sometimes it’s taken by somebody else. I don’t know if it’s a coincidence, but it does happen. And then you should check the Trademarks office database so we can check it.

00;16;04;25 – 00;16;23;07
Unknown
I mean, we can check us for free if it’s available. So pretty much, you know, okay, it’s it’s it’s good. And then you can incorporate so you check the database, so they will check it for you and then you incorporate and then immediately you file a trademark. But you already had the social media and you have the domain name because it’s your way to buy the domain name until you file the trademark.

00;16;23;07 – 00;16;40;10
Unknown
It may be too late because domain domain name is really cheap. So you should get it like immediately. And the social media handles. So those are free. So get them immediately. And that what I what I also wanted to notice it may be too early to file a trademark. It’s too early to file a trademark if you don’t know if you don’t have a business plan, if you don’t know what you’re going to sell.

00;16;40;10 – 00;16;56;23
Unknown
So we’re talking about Amazon sellers. If you decided, okay, I am going to sell on Amazon, but you haven’t done your product research, you don’t know what you’re going to sell. I mean, I guess that’s the most important question, what you’re going to sell, what is that product that will bring you like loss of sales and you will become rich very quickly.

00;16;56;23 – 00;17;16;24
Unknown
And sometimes that takes months to research. So until you know what you’re going to sell, you can truly file a trademark because you cannot file for home products, all like garden products. That’s like too vague. It’s not clear the trademark office will not accept that. So we need to be specific, like, what are we fighting for? I those like pizza cutters are those plate?

00;17;16;24 – 00;17;38;18
Unknown
Are they like, I don’t know, something for the dogs like dog leashes for example. Are they like always cosmetic? So you need to identify your order and you need to be sure that that’s the product you’re going to sell a year later. Because if you changed your mind and we filed for, for example, dog toys and later you decided that you’re going to sell wind chimes, for example, you cannot switch the product in the trademark application.

00;17;38;18 – 00;17;57;10
Unknown
So once you file, you cannot add products, you cannot switch them, you can only remove them. So it’s important to do your research first and no product are going to sell. I mean, of course you don’t have to sell it. Yeah, but you need to know that that’s what I’m going to sell. Okay. Three months later, six months later, a year later, and stick with that decision.

00;17;57;10 – 00;18;16;07
Unknown
So a couple of things I’d like to hit on there and the process. So domain name social media handles and then trademark and then also. But before you can file the trademark you had mentioned, you need to know what you’re selling because when you filed a trademark, it goes for a specific category or product type, which which you’ll need to know prior.

00;18;16;07 – 00;18;35;01
Unknown
And it needs to be preferably you either have already purchased inventory or you’re deep into that you’re not in the decision mode because if you switch it in the trademark that’s filed for a specific category, say wind chimes, you know, a month later you changed it to washers and dryers and that’s not going to work out. And so that’s a very important point.

00;18;35;01 – 00;18;53;21
Unknown
You should already know what you’re selling or maybe even have some on order or something before filing that. So, yes, Yes. Because in the U.S., your trademark will not fully register until you can prove that you sell those products in the U.S. under your trademark name. So the trademark name has to be on the products themselves or on the packaging.

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00;18;53;21 – 00;19;09;20
Unknown
You need to do your product research and identify the products that you know you’re going to sell, because without that, we can’t file. So we cannot file a trademark in advance with no like it’s called a trademark class or like a specific products with no products and the later. So we cannot file an umbrella trademark people often come to us.

00;19;09;20 – 00;19;27;14
Unknown
I wanted the umbrella trademark doesn’t work like this. There is no such thing really. A trademark is always tied to specific products or services. You can just file without any products listed or services listed. And a little bit deeper on this one because I ran into this before. And so you have because there’s all types of classes of products.

00;19;27;14 – 00;19;51;08
Unknown
I know in the U.S., I’m not sure about Canada or other countries, but there’s all types of classes or categories. Okay, So they’re the same. And so if you had this, say, the example, Coca Cola, we’ll just use that Coca Cola likely has two trademark or drinks, some kind of a drink for that trademark for Coca Cola, but maybe someone that wants to sell pants or blouses can can get a trademark for Coca Cola branded in another category.

00;19;51;08 – 00;20;10;23
Unknown
And so there could be different categories. I know I’m kind of butchering this, but like there could be different trademarks for different, you know, the same name in a different category owned by a different company. Is that accurate? Yes. But Coca Cola has trademarks, so pretty much every clock feels like a surprise. And yet. Yes. So what you mentioned is possible for regular trademark.

00;20;10;26 – 00;20;30;18
Unknown
So as long as there is no confusion, the fields do not overlap. You can file the same trademark for completely different products. But when it comes to famous trademarks, it’s a little bit different. That will not allow you pretty much even if the trademark office is okay with that. The company itself will object because they have lots of money and they will not allow anyone else to dilute their brand.

00;20;30;18 – 00;20;48;12
Unknown
So they will not allow you to file Coca Cola for like portable pad products or anything really. You will hear from them very quickly minutes after you filed your trademark. I would say within the week you will get a cease and desist letter or like a demand letter asking you to never launch your, you know, products under this trademark and immediately withdraw your trademark.

00;20;48;12 – 00;21;12;03
Unknown
So you bring up a good point that I wanted. I want to touch on it a little bit. So just to kind of smooth that over, if your brand is X, Y, Z, an unknown brand, and they sell socks and they have a trademark to sell apparel, you could go and get that trademark for X, Y, Z, or potentially you could file for an X, y, Z trademark to sell soccer balls because it’s in a completely different category and the other brand is a small company.

00;21;12;03 – 00;21;27;07
Unknown
They’re not going to object to it because it costs money. And so there’s lots of different, I guess, categories or areas that you can follow the same trademark, the same trademark name for different categories. I’m kind of glad I use Coca-Cola because I’ve actually ran into this before and it was a huge headache with one of my trademarks.

00;21;27;07 – 00;21;50;10
Unknown
A few years back, I filed for Trademark and there was a large company that owned a similar trademark, and I got a letter back that said, We’re objecting to this because it’s too close to ours. And so when that I’m sure that happens quite a bit, depending on what space you’re and, you know, if you hire a company like Trademark and they’ll do research and tell you, hey, you, you might get objected to this, this and this based on what we see in the search.

00;21;50;13 – 00;22;09;08
Unknown
And so that’s always something that I recommend to new sellers that do not go and do this on your own because you can get into a huge storm of legal trouble and it just costs a lot of money. And so they’re definitely want to do a search first to see what who else is in that space that there are large companies, they monitor the database of registrations.

00;22;09;08 – 00;22;26;11
Unknown
And when they see something that pops up that’s similar to theirs, they’re going to object to it. And you you’re up against a large company with a lot of money. Even if you intentionally misspell Coca-Cola, if you spell it with K or you double L, it will not remove the problem. So you will still get a cease and desist letter because it’s confusingly similar.

00;22;26;11 – 00;22;48;29
Unknown
It’s similar. It doesn’t need to be identical. Many people are like mistaken. They think if they changed one letter or misspelled it somehow they remove the problem altogether. But no, it’s still it’s still it’s still a problem. And, you know, I think a lot of larger companies, they’re protecting their their IP because they don’t want a smaller company kind of piggybacking on their branding that they’ve they’ve paid for and they’ve built over the years.

00;22;48;29 – 00;23;07;05
Unknown
And so that’s how they’re protecting it. So just be cautious of that. And so the next question I have is something that I think is asked you. Probably your team probably gets this all the time. It is. How long does a trademark take from when you file it till it’s registered? Maybe we can. I know. I know your company had those trademarks all over the world.

00;23;07;05 – 00;23;26;19
Unknown
Maybe we can cover U.S., Canada and Europe just to kind of keep. Let’s start with the quickest. It’s Germany, actually. It takes two weeks to two months to register trademark in Germany. And it works for Amazon. While it works for brand. By this trade, a German trademark will not work for Amazon dot com hijack every mobile, but it will work for Amazon dot com brand registry.

00;23;26;19 – 00;23;46;03
Unknown
But it will work for transparency. So in the UK and in the European Union and take about four months to register in the US it takes 18 to 20 months right now and in Canada it takes around one or two months to register trademark two months. So it’s yes, North America is unfortunately not very quick. Mexico is quicker though, around the year.

00;23;46;03 – 00;24;05;04
Unknown
One follow up question on that and for Germany, that too. That’s surprising me, too. 2 to 4 weeks to get a registered trademark. Now, will that registered trademark work for EU brand registry to kick off hijackers? No. Well, I don’t think there is. I like Amazon, but EU. I think it’s for every country. It’s all in for France, Italy.

00;24;05;04 – 00;24;22;27
Unknown
So it will work for Amazon, dot the E for the German Amazon. It will work to remove hijackers, yes, but it will not allow you to remove hijackers in France, UK, U.S. So that commits the U.S., U.S., Amazon and Amazon. What city is the Canadian one? So it will not work for that, but it will allow you to get into the brand by the three.

00;24;22;28 – 00;24;41;14
Unknown
Brand registry is single for all countries. One trademark anywhere in the world will unlock brand registry for all Amazon marketplaces. So you just need brand by district and nothing else. Or if you need access to transparency in it’s a cool program, then Germany is the quickest way. I wanted to just explain another thing about Germany, why it’s so quick.

00;24;41;14 – 00;24;57;17
Unknown
I mean, how is it possible? Two weeks? So, I mean, Germans are very clever people. I mean, they have a separate line. So if you pay an extra fee, you get accelerated examination. So they put you in front of the line and examine your trademark very quickly. You get the registration number two weeks later, you know, even like a week sometimes.

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00;24;57;17 – 00;25;17;23
Unknown
And then what happens? Then you trade in all countries. Your trademark is published for opposition purposes before registration. In the US, it’s published before registration. It takes three days where any company may object that registration of your trademarks. So Coca-Cola will object during the time period that you filed for Coca-Cola with key in the election candidates. Two It’s two months.

00;25;17;23 – 00;25;37;01
Unknown
In Germany, it’s actually three months. But that period of potential opposition happens after registration. So they register your trademark first, they give it the registration number and then they publish your trademark. If there are any oppositions and you decide not to defend your trademark, then it’s removed from the list of registered trademarks. But you’re right in the brand by this term, others will not check again.

00;25;37;01 – 00;25;55;02
Unknown
So it’s very safe. I mean, they they never check. I don’t think Amazon knows about just a trademark can be removed. Well, let’s hope they’re not watching this. But on close close your ears. Yeah, well, you just told them now, so that might be kind of a trick for any new sellers that want to get into brand registry in the U.S. You can do that within 2 to 4 weeks in Germany.

00;25;55;02 – 00;26;16;17
Unknown
And so or it gets published much, much faster. So that’s interesting. And so just to kind of clear up everything we’ve talked about, one trademark anywhere in the world will unlock brand registry and all Amazon marketplaces. But you have to have a registered trademark in that country to enforce your your trademark and get hijackers off when it’s useful to file in Germany is if you cannot change your trademark name.

00;26;16;17 – 00;26;33;26
Unknown
But you know, your trademark is not registered in the U.S. because there is a similar trademark and you cannot so you cannot file in the U.S. you cannot register because, you know, your trademark will not go through and you cannot change your name. So then you can file in Germany, it’s just like an alternative way to get access to the brand by just forget it is some protection.

00;26;33;26 – 00;26;54;00
Unknown
Maybe with that, with the transparency program, One thing I wanted to mention, it’s very important is sometimes we file well, very, very seldom. We file a trademark and the client cannot get in the brand by history. They Amazon gives you a reason like abusive behavior, or they give you a list of five or seven reasons. So you have to guess which one it is.

00;26;54;00 – 00;27;15;15
Unknown
So then the name on Amazon is unique, so the brand name is unique. So it’s possible that somebody may have obtained access, you know, to the brand by history with the same name, but maybe from another country. So that’s what we figured. So you and there is no way to check this, unfortunately, because Amazon doesn’t share doesn’t have the list of, you know, brand registry names.

00;27;15;15 – 00;27;35;23
Unknown
But that may be like an option or like the reason why you cannot get in the brand by history. It may be because this name is already taken. Yeah. So it’s wise when we when we check, we can ship like common countries like U.S., UK, European Union, Germany or France, just to make sure that this particular name is not registered anywhere.

00;27;35;26 – 00;27;54;16
Unknown
Because if you’re aware that you are name is registered in the in the country where Amazon has presence, then it’s good idea to know style for this name. Exactly. Yeah, that’s interesting. One follow up question on Europe. Now, you know, for me, living in the U.S., the EU, sometimes that’s kind of confusing to me and how that works.

00;27;54;19 – 00;28;14;25
Unknown
Is there a trademark that covers all of the EU, all of the countries inside of the EU? And do you recommend, you know, sellers applying for that or do you recommend going to each country or actually there is a trade mark that covers all 27 countries in the European Union trademark. It takes about four months, much better to file in the EU then in Germany, but it is more expensive.

00;28;15;01 – 00;28;35;06
Unknown
The government fees in the European Union are much higher than in Germany alone. But yes, if you plan to sell in more than one country in the EU, it’s much better to file in the EU. EU doesn’t cover the UK anymore, so that one country that’s not there. So you need to file in the UK separately. Gotcha. So UK separately and then EU 27 countries.

00;28;35;06 – 00;28;51;09
Unknown
It sounds like it’s a good bang for the buck if you’re going to sell in multiple European countries. The next question is one that also is probably your team gets asked all the time. I hear it all the time. And so it’s like whenever you go to file a trademark, there’s kind of too there’s like a fork in the road.

00;28;51;09 – 00;29;07;03
Unknown
Do you want to trademark your name or do you want to trademark your logo or both? And so what do you recommend for new sellers? Do they trademark their their name of their brand or their logo or both? Yes. So if you plan to sell on Amazon, you definitely need to file a trademark that has some text in it.

00;29;07;03 – 00;29;27;11
Unknown
So it can be either the trademark name, for example, trademark angel, just in the words, you know, just find it out. Trademark angel or it can be trademark angel, plus some image, some picture, but it cannot be just the image alone without any text, because then it will not work for Amazon because they need to be able to read it and it needs to be written after your brand in letters, in text.

00;29;27;16 – 00;29;48;00
Unknown
So if you select one, it’s always better to file for the wordmark just just for the name because it gives you most flexibility you can use it with any logo in any font. In any case, if you filed in all capital letters, sometimes we recommend to file for a combined trademark. So the words plus the image together. It’s called the combined trademark.

00;29;48;04 – 00;30;07;20
Unknown
When your word mark is difficult to get because there are some similar trademarks when your budget is limited to one trademark, but you really want to protect your logo as well, and you can truly file to a trademark. Ideally, it’s best to file two independent trademarks one for the wordmark and one for the logo, because then you can use them independently.

00;30;07;20 – 00;30;25;05
Unknown
They’re not connected to each other. You can use them in different places. If you find the combined trademark, you have to use it exactly as it was filed. You cannot separate it. So that’s a limitation. Okay. So yeah, a couple of different I guess it depends on what your brand name is and, and if your logo includes that or not.

00;30;25;05 – 00;30;54;29
Unknown
And so I guess depending on, you know, each specific instance, So awesome. And so I guess the next one here is let’s say you have a let’s say you have a new product. And so actually one of my brands has a new product. I’m going to file a trademark on a specific product. Now, if you if, if a seller does that on a specific product and they also have a trademark on their brand, can any other sellers not use that product name or how does that work like a trademark on top of a trademark, a brand, and then a product trademark?

00;30;55;00 – 00;31;15;22
Unknown
Yeah, I guess you’re asking about like confusion in the marketplace. So yes, the purpose of a trademark is to prevent confusion in the marketplace to ensure that consumers know like who’s behind a certain product or service. So that’s why like trademark protection only applies to certain products or services. So what do you file a trademark. You put your trademark in a specific class.

00;31;15;22 – 00;31;32;27
Unknown
So there are 45 classes. A trademark gives you monopoly of a specific product and services. So if you file a trademark for a specific product, you have protections for that products and basically for that loss. For example, if we file for, I don’t know, toys, toys in class 28, so no one can file a trademark in class 28 anymore.

00;31;33;04 – 00;31;53;01
Unknown
No one can file a similar trademark in class 28. Let’s say you file a trademark war clothes, clothing is in class 25 Question for you Can somebody file a similar trademark form bags, for example, bags in class 18. What do you think? Can they. No, no. So so an in different class. Yes. You can make it part one for different class.

00;31;53;02 – 00;32;11;07
Unknown
The class is not related, but bags and clothing are related because they go side by side. Usually they’re sold next to each other. So it will be very difficult to buy necessarily the same or very similar trademark for bags because those classes are related. So you get protection for related classes as well. And those are called coordinated classes.

00;32;11;09 – 00;32;40;14
Unknown
The same for jewelry like jewelry and watches and clothing. Usually it’s very difficult to buy just a trademark for like watches or jewelry if you have a trademark for clothing. So you have product several later. If they’re sold side by side, it’s difficult, but they’re not isolated. So let’s say clothing, pet products. So although no problem here, you know, baby, baby, baby toys and clothing, I mean, that’s that’s not isolated, but clothing and bags, it’s related so that it may be a problem.

00;32;40;14 – 00;33;03;03
Unknown
That was something I didn’t learn. I learned a lot of new stuff on this podcast, 45 classes. And so yeah, and then that some classes correlating other classes. So you kind of get extra protection. Yeah. For example, computer software that’s that can be downloaded or like an electronic that’s downloadable computer software, it’s class nine, but software as a service, it’s class 42.

00;33;03;05 – 00;33;23;15
Unknown
But if you file a trademark in class nine, basically no one can file the same trademark in class 42 because those are like coordinated classes. They’re related, they go side by side, really. So there’s are there are a lot of classes with overlap? Yes, actually quite a few. So. Well, was chap not just what this particular product but similar products as well and for like related classes.

00;33;23;15 – 00;33;37;20
Unknown
So when we check a trademark we always check for related classes whether you ask us or not. Okay. that’s interesting. Yeah, that’s something I did not know. So that’s cool. Before we wrap up the podcast is are there any questions that I should have asked you that I didn’t that you want anything you want to share with the audience?

00;33;37;22 – 00;33;57;25
Unknown
Well, you can like what’s basically what’s the best way to file a trademark? Maybe, or like how you approached this? We we did we did mention this briefly. So you should definitely do like a proper trademark search first to make sure your trademark is registered and you should work with the trademark professional. Well, like us or you know, you use a proper forum.

00;33;57;25 – 00;34;13;01
Unknown
I mean, don’t try to, you know, save money and do it yourself or use like I mean, that there are a lot of companies that basically sell you software that allows you to file your own trademark, but no one is checking your trademark, so don’t use one of those. Yeah, no, that’s very good for all the listeners. Yeah.

00;34;13;01 – 00;34;33;19
Unknown
You know, yet you can go to, you know, the USPTO, you can kind of do basic searches on their databases. But I always recommend hiring an agent, hiring someone that’s like trademark angel to file your trademarks. Because if you make a mistake on this, it can cost you a lot of money down the road when when it doesn’t work out or someone files an objection, you don’t know how to handle that.

00;34;33;19 – 00;34;50;14
Unknown
Or there are so many things that can go wrong that you want someone helping you that has a lot of experience with this. And so we offer a free trademark search anyway. In the free. And after you decide to proceed with us, we do a comprehensive search. And if your trademark is not creditable, well, we can refund you the money.

00;34;50;14 – 00;35;06;19
Unknown
So it’s free anyway, I said stand by, distribute. And if your trademark is not not thereby destroyed, you don’t lose the money. Like we can file another trademark for free. So we work with you. Ensure that your trademark is registered because we’re in the same boat. If we don’t manage to register your trademark, we just repeat the process or we don’t want to do that.

00;35;06;19 – 00;35;24;01
Unknown
So that’s why we only file for trademarks that I just trouble. We’re very, very conservative when it comes to assessment because we don’t want to, you know, repeat the process or, you know, we know that our clients invest a lot of time, a lot of money. And like when a trademark is not registered, it’s not just, okay, $1,000 lost.

00;35;24;02 – 00;35;46;04
Unknown
It’s a lot of effort, lost time, lost inventory. So when the stand, how painful it can be. So we try not to file for trademarks that are low probability trademarks that are not registered. Also, we tell you in advance, so we help you avoid those costly mistakes. That’s excellent. And I’ll preface this last question here by Anita and I talked before the show, and I have used Trademark Angel before and one of a one of our brands to get a trademark in Canada.

00;35;46;04 – 00;36;06;04
Unknown
And the process went wonderful. It was great experience. So I highly recommend Trademark Angel. And so, Anita, question for you. What separates trademark Angel from other companies out there and why should the listeners choose trademark? Angel Yes, exactly. As I said, we will. Unlike many, many law firms, we we’re interested in registering your trademark with the least number of objections.

00;36;06;06 – 00;36;23;11
Unknown
There is a package that includes all responses. Basically, you pay one C and we handle everything. And so what? Interested in the least painful process for you in the quickest process in the process that results in the minimum objections. And also if the trademark is it feels like we’ll find another framework for you and we don’t charge you.

00;36;23;11 – 00;36;42;23
Unknown
So we are interested to file your trademark in one go without repeating the process and without receiving any objection. So the quicker your trademark is registered, the. But it is fraught. And yeah, as I said, we were for free initial search of free consultation. There are no strings attached. We don’t charge for phone calls ever actually don’t. We don’t keep track.

00;36;42;23 – 00;37;01;13
Unknown
We don’t count minutes what on below for the, you know, hours, a minutes. We don’t do that. So it’s basically flat. C’s in no way approachable can ask us any questions. We know how to work with Amazon sellers and what you need to get in the brand registry. We call up you with that as well. And then at the end of the show and then the show notes, we’re going to have all the contacts and how to reach Anita and her team.

00;37;01;13 – 00;37;21;10
Unknown
If you’re ready for a Q and A trademark one thing. Yes and discount. If you mention that if they mention your podcast, they will get 10% discount. Excellent. You heard right there, 10% discount off. You mentioned Firing the Man podcast. Thank you for that, Anita or all of our guest. We run them through the ringer. It’s called the Fire and it’s a series of four questions and it’s Rapid Fire.

00;37;21;11 – 00;37;42;11
Unknown
Are you ready? All right. What is your favorite book? Yes. So my favorite book is called The Perfume The Story of Ramona. Right? It’s by Patrick Suskind that the German author. It’s great. Awesome. That’s a new one. I haven’t heard of that one. I read it. Yeah, I’ll put on my list. What are your hobbies? I like traveling and I like gardening and I like I have like a huge tank fish tank.

00;37;42;12 – 00;38;02;18
Unknown
Houdini’s thousand liters. That’s big. Is it saltwater fresh? No, it’s regular. Well, normal. Normal water. I think saltwater is the next one on the list. Okay, that’s awesome. That sounds fun. What is one thing that you do not miss about working for the man? Yes. Getting dressed for the office, putting my makeup on, spending 2 hours on the train.

00;38;02;18 – 00;38;27;03
Unknown
Yes. Those are the three things I don’t miss. Okay. Yeah, I agree. What do you think sets apart successful entrepreneurs from those who give up, fail or never get started? Well, actually, I strongly believe it’s a business plan. It’s thinking about all their potential problems you may have and having like a B plan, thinking about like potential pioneers or problems and ended up with a plan of how, what, what will happen if they happen.

00;38;27;03 – 00;38;44;17
Unknown
So I think it’s a business plan. And then while if you have a problem, just don’t give up immediately. Follow your business plan. I mean, remember that it could have happened. So do not give up. Just try to continue. And I think that’s what separates successful people. Okay. I like it. Have a have a backup plan and continue to go on.

00;38;44;17 – 00;38;59;26
Unknown
And so, Anita, it was a pleasure having you on the podcast. I really want to say thanks for sharing all of your knowledge with trademarks. What what the audience if someone in the audience is listening and they want to reach out to you or your team and get a trademark, what’s the best way to do that? Well, go to our Web site, right?

00;39;00;04 – 00;39;15;16
Unknown
Angel dot com and there is like a contact us button so you can call us, you can send us an email, we can chat your website, chat with us, you can find us on Facebook. It’s pretty easy. Excellent. You heard that. And we’ll have it all in the show notes, the links to Trademark Intercom and everything will be in the show notes.

00;39;15;16 – 00;39;21;27
Unknown
So if you’re driving, just keep your eyes on the road. Excellent Well, thanks for listening. Well, 2 minutes with you. Thank you for having me.