Boosting E-commerce Sales: Insights from Shopify Optimization Expert Matthew Stafford

Episode 192

How would you like to revolutionize your e-commerce store and boost your revenue? Promise fulfilled, as we bring you insights from none other than the leading Shopify optimization expert, Matthew Stafford, in this power-packed episode of our Firing the Man podcast. Matthew spills the beans on enhancing your e-commerce conversion rates and shares his fascinating journey into the e-commerce world.

What if your homepage could build trust while offering easy navigation? What if filters on category pages simplified choices for your customers? Intrigued? That’s just the tip of the iceberg! As our conversation with Matthew continues, we tap into the power of AB testing and data analytics, learning how to track performance, set up reports, and understand trends using Google Analytics 4 and Tag Manager. Be amazed as Matthew unveils secrets of harnessing data for boosting your website’s functionalities.

The third part of our episode takes us deep into e-commerce optimization. We share a passionate discussion with Matthew on customer segmentation and how categorizing customers based on their purchase history can maximize data usage and encourage repeat business. We also explore the impact of high-quality images and easy navigation in enhancing conversion rates. Wrapping up, Matthew shares the significance of discipline for success in e-commerce and reveals his favorite book and hobbies. If you’re an entrepreneur or an established online seller, this episode promises a wealth of wisdom to optimize your e-commerce business for skyrocketing success.

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Welcome everyone to the Firing The Man Podcast. On today’s episode, we are joined by Matthew Stafford.

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Matthew is the mad scientist behind the data in development of

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build grow in scale

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revenue optimization system.

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Although he won’t tell you himself,

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he’s also

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known as the top

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Shopify

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optimization expert in the game.

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Matthew has a keen eye for obstacles on the customer journey and his great at interpreting data to find the diamonds in the rough.

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He also has the ability to see things from a business owners perspective. Having run his own companies for the past ten years.

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On today’s episode, we are diving deep into conversion rate optimization

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and how online sellers can use this metric as a measuring stick for success.

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Welcome to the show, Matt.

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Welcome. Glad to be here.

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Thank you. Thank you.

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So

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can you please share with our listeners a little bit about yourself

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and your path in the eCommerce world?

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Yeah. So I started actually by accident. I was in a service business.

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I had a commercial concrete

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company,

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and so we traveled all over the country doing Menards,

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Home Depot’s

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Walmarts, Lowe’s, big box stores.

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And I signed up for Tony Robbins event

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and went to the Tony Robbins event in Bada.

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kind of date to me, but he was selling a DVD series called Money Masters.

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And in there,

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the very first month that I received, it was a

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DVD from Frank Kern

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on how to sell E-books, where you could teach your parent how to talk.

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And I thought, Wow, that’s

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crazy. You can use online, you know, you can use the Internet to sell stuff

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and have this

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big audience.

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Because

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for me, I was on the road about 200 days a year

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pouring concrete. And if it was rain and we didn’t work, it was,

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you know, bad weather to call. And now we had to

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do a whole bunch of extra work, all these different things that that man, if I could

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build something online,

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my income would be a lot more scalable without having to go through all the problems.

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And so I started listening to that, and that’s kind of what

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took me into the

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online world.

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That’s awesome. So, Matt,

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welcome to the show and thanks for sharing part of your story. And it’s kind of

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interesting. We’re like

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doing the concrete bit

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and then you’re like on Rainy days, you’re like, Yeah,

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you know, and then you find something online.

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You’re like, Oh, this is open all day long, 24/7, 365. And so it kind of,

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yeah, eye opening. And so

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let’s get right into it. I love conversion rate.

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I think it’s one of the top

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KPIs for e-commerce. I think it should be one of the top KPIs for most businesses, but

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what are some of the top ways

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that what are some of the most effective strategies for improving ecommerce conversion rates that you know

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So it’s going to sound funny, but I’m going to tell

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tell you it’s a paradigm shift because all of us and probably the majority of people that we’re talking to our e-commerce store owners

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or an online business owner

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in, we always look at our website as how can we make.

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Like, what do I have to do to make Marcel’s?

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And that’s not

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what the customer comes to your site

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thinking.

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How do I go find a site to spend money on?

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They they actually come to your site

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and say,

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I have a problem. I’m looking to solve that or I have a need and I’m looking to find,

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you know, a way to fill that need.

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And if you can go to your site

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as a customer

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and think like, oh, what are they, what are they looking to solve or what are they looking to buy?

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How easy is it to do that?

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And what you’ll find is that little shift

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will show all kinds of things on your website

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that aren’t working

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or that are confusing

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or that are slowing down the process for them to get to what they want to find.

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I really, really like that. And so

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let’s say like, let’s break down

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to that point.

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What what would be some tips and tricks to, let’s say

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we sold water bottles,

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I don’t even know what brand this is, but we sell water bottles. We have a website. We have

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three different types of water bottles,

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several sizes and colors.

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What would be something like on the home page or the landing page that you would recommend

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like a high level design on?

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Like what you said when someone hit your site, they have a problem, they’re looking to solve their problem. And so how do you how do you help them do that?

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the other thing that I would say is each page has a particular purpose.

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And so a lot of times like when you’re talking about your home page, your home page is not designed to sell.

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Your home page is designed to

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build trust,

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then give them easy navigation to what they’re looking for.

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So if you have if you have a water bottle, say that you have, I don’t know,

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30 colors or 20 colors

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and

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four or five different designs

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when they come there, that’s like paradox of choice.

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So they can go, Oh, I want a pink one

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and or they come to the home page.

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Oh, I like, you know, I’m a bigger water bottle or I want to travel

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size or whatever.

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Kind of break it down into categories

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and get them under the category page where you have filters.

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So

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once they can filter it down, now instead of having 50 choices, they have four or five.

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They can find what they’re looking for and they’ll convert much higher.

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So we know

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everything that we do is data driven.

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The two most valuable sources of traffic on your site are the people that use the search bar

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and the people that use the filters.

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Those two people can converge higher and are worth more value per session

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and anyone else that ever comes to the site.

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And so by

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tagging those two elements,

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essentially what you’re doing is you’re taking this big top of funnel area, you’re bringing it down to

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the three or four things that interest based off of them choosing

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and then they convert much higher.

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Before we get to into the weeds, on which I’m very excited about,

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can we get a working definition of conversion rate?

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There may be some listeners that are wondering what exactly are we talking about?

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Yes.

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I won’t

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contradict what you said, but I’ll challenge it a little bit. I don’t really believe that conversion rate

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optimization is the most important metric.

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I believe it’s very important.

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But how you achieve it is probably

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the caveat that I would say,

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because we can always give you a higher conversion rate, we could just lower the price of your product

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and your conversion rate would go up.

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That doesn’t necessarily help you. It might actually even hurt you.

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So the reason why we coined the term revenue optimization is because

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we really want

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to

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make profit.

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And so if your whole site

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is built in a way that

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from when they land on it until they check out, they have a good experience, that’s actually where you’re going to achieve.

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You will get a higher conversion rate

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or you could actually even offer.

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We’ve raised the price and raised conversion rates before. So we tried different things

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all the different all different ways.

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Very nice.

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So what metrics

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should you be focused? So you had mentioned revenue.

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When you’re looking at your conversion rate and you’re trying to move the needle,

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what are you focused on

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nowadays? Because of the costs of traffic,

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your average order value is really important.

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And then knowing how long

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you can actually spend money in order to acquire customers,

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knowing how many times to come back and buy a second, third, fourth time.

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So I would say average order value,

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repeat customer rate.

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and then probably third would be our conversion.

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And one last question

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You had mentioned

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testing,

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and that’s something that

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so on Amazon, they have it’s called the AB testing program, which is great. So for instance, if you’re testing your main image,

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it’ll swap it out multiple times a day

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when that is not present.

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How are you performing those tests?

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We use Google Optimizer

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and then

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we’re also building our own solution because Optimizer is about to go away.

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But Optimizer right now, as of right now, it

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puts all that information into Google Analytics.

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And we used that with tag manager

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extensively. So that’s what we use

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do our tests.

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So just to pick up off

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kind of that AB testing and optimizing

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so some

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have you guys I guess G-4 or Google Analytics for has been

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just we just kind of switched over. They kind of deprecated the old one and moved to the new one now.

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And so

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some of the stuff in there I’ve looked at and some of it looks really cool with the funnels and it’s way more,

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you know, it’s user friendly now where you can kind of look at the entire shopping experience.

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Are you guys using those tools as well and do you recommend

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someone that’s not

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deep into optimization on their site

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to even scratch the surface on that and just take a look at the metrics there?

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Yeah. So I would certainly say that if you’re not

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using data, then you’re just guessing.

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And

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the other thing that I would say is we do this all day, every day.

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We have about 30 people on our team

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and we run tests and are constantly trying to optimize

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and

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I would say probably have half or more of our tests fail,

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like it either gives no left or it’s worse.

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And that’s us doing this every day. So a regular store owner, if they’re not using data,

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they’re really not

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going to ever know if

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they change a couple of things, if it’s helping or hurting, whatever.

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They’re just going to be

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on this loop of

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not understanding. And so the data, yeah, you have to use it.

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What I would say would be a really good thing to do is

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to set up a report that gets like emailed to you once a week from Google

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and it can have like your average site speed on your most landed on pages.

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So just checking your home

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page, which is what a lot of people do, they go, Oh,

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want to check my sites and they put in their home page URL.

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That’s the site speed for your home page. That’s not the site’s feed for your site.

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And so every page has it. So just

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find out like, what are your hero products?

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So it might be four or five URLs you plug doesn’t

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have it. Email you once a week.

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the landing page speed is,

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another one would be

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average revenue per user

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which they’ll give you are

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repeat customers and first time buyers.

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And so once you start looking at those, you’ll see trends

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is my page, is my site getting slower or all of a sudden this one page dropped.

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Now you can go look at it and find out what’s going on much quicker.

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Otherwise you might just go, Yeah, conversions down. But we have no reason. We don’t know why because everything looks good.

00;09;56;25 – 00;09;58;05
Unknown
The problem is

00;09;58;05 – 00;10;01;24
Unknown
a browser could do an update, so it might be Chrome on an android device

00;10;01;24 – 00;10;06;18
Unknown
is where your your market is and for some reason that’s not displaying

00;10;06;18 – 00;10;07;08
Unknown
good.

00;10;07;08 – 00;10;09;00
Unknown
When the new update came out

00;10;09;00 – 00;10;11;07
Unknown
and you would never know that if you’re not tracking

00;10;11;07 – 00;10;13;18
Unknown
know your higher landing pages.

00;10;13;18 – 00;10;14;19
Unknown
I really like that. And

00;10;14;19 – 00;10;17;27
Unknown
just to dig a little bit deeper on that one now is are those reports

00;10;17;27 – 00;10;24;24
Unknown
like inside of G4 or you’re target like page speed insights or how do you create those reports like for your hero pages?

00;10;24;24 – 00;10;31;13
Unknown
Yeah, you can create animations idea for and then Google will actually send your email you good to have it sent to you every day, every week.

00;10;31;13 – 00;10;34;29
Unknown
My theory is if you’re at a center every day

00;10;34;29 – 00;10;38;18
Unknown
after a few days that you didn’t look at it, you’ll get in the habit of not looking at it.

00;10;38;18 – 00;10;45;04
Unknown
If you send it to yourself once a week, that’s a more sustainable to take a look and go, okay, I’ll spend that 5 minutes and do it.

00;10;45;04 – 00;10;46;26
Unknown
I would much rather have someone

00;10;46;26 – 00;10;49;11
Unknown
looking at it once a week or even once a month,

00;10;49;11 – 00;10;54;23
Unknown
then getting it every day and then asset and becoming none of that email not looking anymore. And

00;10;54;23 – 00;10;57;03
Unknown
otherwise, all that work that you set up for nothing.

00;10;57;03 – 00;10;58;00
Unknown
I like that. I’m

00;10;58;00 – 00;10;59;12
Unknown
I was taking notes.

00;10;59;12 – 00;11;02;08
Unknown
I’m going to set up some of those reports for for our hero pages.

00;11;02;08 – 00;11;02;19
Unknown
So

00;11;02;19 – 00;11;06;08
Unknown
one follow up on the kind of the AB testing. And so

00;11;06;08 – 00;11;11;12
Unknown
this is something that David and I and I and our team we had recently ran a huge test

00;11;11;12 – 00;11;16;16
Unknown
I would say was we changed up variations. So we have a we have a brand that sells

00;11;16;16 – 00;11;18;21
Unknown
products that are in multiple designs like,

00;11;18;21 – 00;11;20;13
Unknown
say, like 40 different designs.

00;11;20;13 – 00;11;22;14
Unknown
And so we kind of split it up to test out

00;11;22;14 – 00;11;26;09
Unknown
what we felt like, Hey, how can we get more sales? Let’s let’s try to test

00;11;26;09 – 00;11;27;20
Unknown
splitting this up into

00;11;27;20 – 00;11;34;23
Unknown
maybe eight designs here of like bestsellers, maybe eight here that are on clearance and kind of like split it up until like five different test groups.

00;11;34;23 – 00;11;35;12
Unknown
And so

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Unknown
we ran those.

00;11;36;06 – 00;11;37;17
Unknown
And then after two weeks,

00;11;37;17 – 00;11;45;06
Unknown
none of that, all of the data was where our sales were down between 30 and 50% across the board. And so we reverted, we backed out.

00;11;45;06 – 00;11;48;21
Unknown
So you and your team do a lot tons of testing with clients. So

00;11;48;21 – 00;11;50;22
Unknown
what is your like usually your minimal

00;11;50;22 – 00;11;52;15
Unknown
testing period and when do you say,

00;11;52;15 – 00;11;54;02
Unknown
let’s pull the plug and revert back

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Unknown
period?

00;11;54;10 – 00;11;59;05
Unknown
Yeah. So it’s a minimum of seven days because you can get a lot of false positives or even false negatives

00;11;59;05 – 00;12;01;20
Unknown
in the first few days. Like you might go, Oh, wow, this test

00;12;01;20 – 00;12;02;20
Unknown
killing it. And then

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Unknown
by the end of the seven days it evens out. So

00;12;04;25 – 00;12;06;06
Unknown
seven days at least

00;12;06;06 – 00;12;08;10
Unknown
gives you a good, good list.

00;12;08;10 – 00;12;09;01
Unknown
And then

00;12;09;01 – 00;12;10;24
Unknown
the statistical significance,

00;12;10;24 – 00;12;13;23
Unknown
honestly, most websites don’t get enough

00;12;13;23 – 00;12;15;20
Unknown
for statistical significance.

00;12;15;20 – 00;12;17;08
Unknown
And so their tests have to run

00;12;17;08 – 00;12;18;08
Unknown
quite a bit longer.

00;12;18;08 – 00;12;20;09
Unknown
There’s a few different ways that you can

00;12;20;09 – 00;12;24;12
Unknown
you can use what’s called design of experiments, which is a mathematical formula to help

00;12;24;12 – 00;12;25;06
Unknown
make predictive.

00;12;25;06 – 00;12;28;19
Unknown
probably more complicated than the majority of people would want to try to do.

00;12;28;19 – 00;12;30;17
Unknown
yeah, I would say seven days minimum.

00;12;30;17 – 00;12;33;05
Unknown
continuing that conversation about the test that we ran.

00;12;33;05 – 00;12;34;25
Unknown
What we did was

00;12;34;25 – 00;12;36;25
Unknown
we ran it for about two weeks

00;12;36;25 – 00;12;40;08
Unknown
so we had say we started the test on the first and ran it

00;12;40;08 – 00;12;41;12
Unknown
for the first two weeks.

00;12;41;12 – 00;12;42;18
Unknown
What we did was we did a

00;12;42;18 – 00;12;43;14
Unknown
look back,

00;12;43;14 – 00;12;45;11
Unknown
so we said, okay, two weeks prior

00;12;45;11 – 00;12;45;27
Unknown
and then

00;12;45;27 – 00;12;48;27
Unknown
two weeks post and we compared those two groups.

00;12;48;27 – 00;12;50;01
Unknown
The one thing that

00;12;50;01 – 00;12;52;04
Unknown
was always in the back of my mind was

00;12;52;04 – 00;12;57;04
Unknown
time period bias. So for instance, if that two weeks was included, Black Friday,

00;12;57;04 – 00;13;00;07
Unknown
it may appear to be performing way better.

00;13;00;07 – 00;13;02;27
Unknown
and also there’s a lot of different moving parts.

00;13;02;27 – 00;13;05;06
Unknown
So for instance, maybe you go out of stock

00;13;05;06 – 00;13;08;07
Unknown
if it’s paid traffic, that can change by the day.

00;13;08;09 – 00;13;10;02
Unknown
They could send you a bunch of,

00;13;10;02 – 00;13;11;01
Unknown
you know, they could be

00;13;11;01 – 00;13;12;28
Unknown
testing their top a funnel too,

00;13;12;28 – 00;13;16;01
Unknown
or you could have bot traffic, you could have a whole. But so

00;13;16;01 – 00;13;19;00
Unknown
what you did is not actually a B test.

00;13;19;00 – 00;13;21;00
Unknown
And a B test is where

00;13;21;00 – 00;13;22;29
Unknown
you would send half of them to this

00;13;22;29 – 00;13;24;29
Unknown
layout and half to this layout.

00;13;24;29 – 00;13;26;06
Unknown
What I would think

00;13;26;06 – 00;13;27;09
Unknown
you could do

00;13;27;09 – 00;13;29;26
Unknown
if I was trying to if I was trying to think do this myself,

00;13;29;26 – 00;13;32;05
Unknown
there’s something called Paradox of choice.

00;13;32;05 – 00;13;35;01
Unknown
And so the more choices that you give people,

00;13;35;01 – 00;13;37;21
Unknown
the lower your conversion is. And if you think about it,

00;13;37;21 – 00;13;39;26
Unknown
they’ll come and they go, Oh, I like this one.

00;13;39;26 – 00;13;41;17
Unknown
I like that one too.

00;13;41;17 – 00;13;42;22
Unknown
And I

00;13;42;22 – 00;13;44;21
Unknown
kind of I don’t know if I like this one.

00;13;44;21 – 00;13;48;09
Unknown
I have three. My boss just walked up. I got to close the tab or up.

00;13;48;09 – 00;13;49;01
Unknown
The kids just

00;13;49;01 – 00;13;49;15
Unknown
came.

00;13;49;15 – 00;13;51;04
Unknown
And so what’s happening is

00;13;51;04 – 00;13;52;28
Unknown
you almost have this click that

00;13;52;28 – 00;13;57;02
Unknown
where the more things that you give them to click on are, the more choices to make,

00;13;57;02 – 00;13;58;17
Unknown
the longer it takes.

00;13;58;17 – 00;14;01;12
Unknown
then they go. Others come back when I have more time.

00;14;01;12 – 00;14;03;01
Unknown
And so what I would do is

00;14;03;01 – 00;14;03;21
Unknown
I would

00;14;03;21 – 00;14;04;18
Unknown
not just

00;14;04;18 – 00;14;08;04
Unknown
separate the 40 that you have, 40 designs that you have.

00;14;08;04 – 00;14;11;22
Unknown
I would look at the 40 designs that you have and find out which

00;14;11;22 – 00;14;12;20
Unknown
four of them

00;14;12;20 – 00;14;13;06
Unknown
made

00;14;13;06 – 00;14;16;03
Unknown
50% of the sales, 60% of the sales.

00;14;16;03 – 00;14;19;09
Unknown
And I would find a way to put that in a category.

00;14;19;09 – 00;14;20;18
Unknown
And then the other ones

00;14;20;18 – 00;14;24;04
Unknown
doing it that way, I think that you’re going to increase your sales for sure

00;14;24;04 – 00;14;29;05
Unknown
because people don’t want to be the first one to try something out and they know that

00;14;29;05 – 00;14;32;03
Unknown
this one has a bunch of reviewers or this category has

00;14;32;03 – 00;14;33;15
Unknown
the best sellers,

00;14;33;15 – 00;14;34;09
Unknown
etc.

00;14;34;09 – 00;14;36;04
Unknown
You can create that

00;14;36;04 – 00;14;37;26
Unknown
process and there had

00;14;37;26 – 00;14;39;23
Unknown
not having to be the first one to buy it.

00;14;39;23 – 00;14;44;21
Unknown
On the paradox of choice have you found a sweet spot for number of variations?

00;14;44;21 – 00;14;47;06
Unknown
Yeah, less than five. Five or less.

00;14;47;06 – 00;14;47;19
Unknown
Okay.

00;14;47;19 – 00;14;48;12
Unknown
So and

00;14;48;12 – 00;14;53;18
Unknown
just to give you how we did that, so we have a couple of very large partners stores that are

00;14;53;18 – 00;14;54;15
Unknown
print on demand

00;14;54;15 – 00;14;58;09
Unknown
so they can give them literally almost unlimited choices.

00;14;58;09 – 00;15;01;11
Unknown
And we’ve seen as many as 14 or 15

00;15;01;11 – 00;15;04;14
Unknown
when they first came to us. And I will tell you,

00;15;04;14 – 00;15;05;26
Unknown
five or less will convert

00;15;05;26 – 00;15;09;21
Unknown
multiples more. So you could have 14 different choices and collars.

00;15;09;21 – 00;15;13;15
Unknown
drop it down to three or four and you’ll more than double your conversion rate.

00;15;13;15 – 00;15;16;10
Unknown
It’s just insane. People think more is better,

00;15;16;10 – 00;15;17;15
Unknown
more is not better.

00;15;17;15 – 00;15;20;19
Unknown
And that has never proven to be better for us ever.

00;15;20;19 – 00;15;22;27
Unknown
Okay, that’s that’s really, really helpful.

00;15;22;27 – 00;15;25;06
Unknown
Yeah. So, Matt, if a listener is

00;15;25;06 – 00;15;26;07
Unknown
listening to the show

00;15;26;07 – 00;15;30;06
Unknown
and they’re like, they’ve never ran any test of the Shopify store,

00;15;30;06 – 00;15;35;12
Unknown
a lot of a lot of our listeners sell on Amazon, Walmart and they also probably have a Shopify store. So

00;15;35;12 – 00;15;37;21
Unknown
they are, they have Shopify store, They’re doing, you know,

00;15;37;21 – 00;15;39;11
Unknown
5000, 10,000 a month

00;15;39;11 – 00;15;40;06
Unknown
and they’ve never

00;15;40;06 – 00;15;45;20
Unknown
ran any split, any any testing on it at all with testing Abbey whatever converted, nothing for conversion rate.

00;15;45;20 – 00;15;46;27
Unknown
What would be the top

00;15;46;27 – 00;15;48;22
Unknown
first thing to focus on for that.

00;15;48;22 – 00;15;50;05
Unknown
I would say

00;15;50;05 – 00;15;52;26
Unknown
clarity trumps persuasion. So

00;15;52;26 – 00;15;54;24
Unknown
what I mean by that is

00;15;54;24 – 00;15;59;06
Unknown
you want to look at your site and say, would Homer Simpson understand

00;15;59;06 – 00;16;00;07
Unknown
the navigation?

00;16;00;07 – 00;16;01;14
Unknown
Would Homer Simpson

00;16;01;14 – 00;16;03;23
Unknown
understand this product description?

00;16;03;23 – 00;16;08;00
Unknown
But Homer Simpson understood. And the text on the button,

00;16;08;00 – 00;16;10;02
Unknown
those types of things.

00;16;10;02 – 00;16;12;29
Unknown
People don’t realize that most of them,

00;16;12;29 – 00;16;16;10
Unknown
they’re answering their own customer service in the beginning to.

00;16;16;10 – 00;16;19;16
Unknown
And so every question they get, they think that’s a problem

00;16;19;16 – 00;16;20;08
Unknown
and they all

00;16;20;08 – 00;16;21;26
Unknown
put the answer on the website.

00;16;21;26 – 00;16;24;18
Unknown
Well, now what they’ve done is they’ve really made their site

00;16;24;18 – 00;16;28;25
Unknown
navigable for the 20% of people that have the problems and

00;16;28;25 – 00;16;31;21
Unknown
excluded the 80% of the people that had no problem.

00;16;31;21 – 00;16;33;07
Unknown
And so what they’ve really done is

00;16;33;07 – 00;16;36;29
Unknown
now all the sudden for somebody to find what they want, they have to go down this

00;16;36;29 – 00;16;38;16
Unknown
huge list of stuff

00;16;38;16 – 00;16;43;12
Unknown
just to get to where they’re going. And a lot of times that’s not necessary.

00;16;43;12 – 00;16;46;15
Unknown
The biggest lifts we ever get in conversion and

00;16;46;15 – 00;16;48;09
Unknown
nine out of ten times

00;16;48;09 – 00;16;54;25
Unknown
for the first three or four months we work on a site is actually finding what’s on the site and removing it that nobody’s using.

00;16;54;25 – 00;16;56;11
Unknown
basically simple is better.

00;16;56;11 – 00;16;56;29
Unknown
Yes,

00;16;56;29 – 00;16;58;02
Unknown
100%.

00;16;58;02 – 00;16;58;18
Unknown
I like it

00;16;58;18 – 00;16;59;00
Unknown
So

00;16;59;00 – 00;17;06;16
Unknown
that’s simple. So if you’re listening, it’s very simple. Just go and make your site simple and solve their problem when they hit the homepage, direct them to where they can.

00;17;06;16 – 00;17;10;02
Unknown
You know, all the products you have, direct them to exactly where how to solve that problem.

00;17;10;02 – 00;17;16;26
Unknown
I would say for sure the very best things that a new start can do is make sure that search

00;17;16;26 – 00;17;18;29
Unknown
really understood, where it’s at,

00;17;18;29 – 00;17;21;29
Unknown
that little search icon is not actually

00;17;21;29 – 00;17;22;22
Unknown
good enough.

00;17;22;22 – 00;17;28;01
Unknown
So they should put the word search under it, just like under the hamburger icon. They should put menu,

00;17;28;01 – 00;17;28;28
Unknown
because

00;17;28;28 – 00;17;31;29
Unknown
if you think about it before I call it, only about 10% of

00;17;31;29 – 00;17;33;06
Unknown
sales were done online

00;17;33;06 – 00;17;33;29
Unknown
during COVID.

00;17;33;29 – 00;17;37;10
Unknown
It got as high as 33%. And now that we’re back to normal,

00;17;37;10 – 00;17;39;00
Unknown
it’s about 27%.

00;17;39;00 – 00;17;40;19
Unknown
people don’t realize that

00;17;40;19 – 00;17;41;29
Unknown
online shopping

00;17;41;29 – 00;17;43;10
Unknown
is still actually

00;17;43;10 – 00;17;44;29
Unknown
we’re in the early stages of it.

00;17;44;29 – 00;17;46;10
Unknown
People are just

00;17;46;10 – 00;17;49;14
Unknown
getting online all the time and figuring this out.

00;17;49;14 – 00;17;53;04
Unknown
And so all the things that we take for granted that we understand

00;17;53;04 – 00;17;53;26
Unknown
they don’t.

00;17;53;26 – 00;17;58;23
Unknown
And so that’s what I mean by does Homer Simpson know at this little circle with the dash on, it means

00;17;58;23 – 00;18;00;26
Unknown
does he know what these three lines mean?

00;18;00;26 – 00;18;03;17
Unknown
No. So just put words there. If it says menu,

00;18;03;17 – 00;18;06;14
Unknown
how hard is that to understand? Oh, that’s the menu.

00;18;06;14 – 00;18;08;07
Unknown
Yeah. Oh, that’s the search.

00;18;08;07 – 00;18;12;22
Unknown
And by just adding those little things, you’ll be shocked at what it’ll do to your conversion rate.

00;18;12;22 – 00;18;14;22
Unknown
That’s incredible. I just want to follow back on that.

00;18;14;22 – 00;18;16;26
Unknown
one example is we were had we had a meeting

00;18;16;26 – 00;18;19;29
Unknown
in our company a few weeks ago and I was like, yes, you know,

00;18;19;29 – 00;18;21;29
Unknown
click the hamburger menu and go down to do that.

00;18;21;29 – 00;18;23;06
Unknown
And the person was like,

00;18;23;06 – 00;18;23;20
Unknown
No,

00;18;23;20 – 00;18;28;15
Unknown
I’m like, I just took for granted from having an I.T. background that a hamburger menu is two, three lines.

00;18;28;15 – 00;18;29;10
Unknown
But you’re right. Like,

00;18;29;10 – 00;18;36;01
Unknown
if I wanted to ask my parents or some of my siblings who do not have an I.T. back, they’re not going to get a hamburger menu. As. And so putting that menu there

00;18;36;01 – 00;18;36;23
Unknown
sounds

00;18;36;23 – 00;18;37;08
Unknown
complicated.

00;18;37;09 – 00;18;44;06
Unknown
You know, it sounds like why should we have to do that? But you’re right. How would Homer Simpson be able to know what a hamburger menu is? Probably not. So I like it.

00;18;44;06 – 00;18;49;14
Unknown
One one last question here. And I love statistics and probably people listening to this are wondering

00;18;49;14 – 00;18;52;09
Unknown
what is a good conversion rate? And so I’ll preface that with

00;18;52;09 – 00;18;53;29
Unknown
a lot of our listeners still on Amazon.

00;18;53;29 – 00;18;55;20
Unknown
And so were anything,

00;18;55;20 – 00;18;58;18
Unknown
ten or below, we troubleshoot anything 20 or higher.

00;18;58;18 – 00;18;59;20
Unknown
We are happy,

00;18;59;20 – 00;18;59;27
Unknown
but

00;18;59;27 – 00;19;03;03
Unknown
eCommerce stores, Shopify, WordPress, whatever,

00;19;03;03 – 00;19;05;21
Unknown
different story. So can you maybe give a high level

00;19;05;21 – 00;19;07;12
Unknown
of what is a good conversion rate?

00;19;07;12 – 00;19;13;12
Unknown
And if you’re below this, because I know it depends on product type, it depends a lot of stuff, but what is an average

00;19;13;12 – 00;19;15;10
Unknown
industry specific for e-commerce?

00;19;15;10 – 00;19;20;11
Unknown
And if it’s below a certain point you should troubleshoot. And if it’s if it’s higher, then you should be happy.

00;19;20;11 – 00;19;22;28
Unknown
Yeah, that’s again, that’s a loaded question for sure.

00;19;22;28 – 00;19;24;04
Unknown
I would say

00;19;24;04 – 00;19;26;07
Unknown
it depends on your average order value.

00;19;26;07 – 00;19;28;19
Unknown
So if you have an average order value of

00;19;28;19 – 00;19;29;18
Unknown
50 bucks,

00;19;29;18 – 00;19;33;18
Unknown
you probably can convert, you know, five, 6%

00;19;33;18 – 00;19;35;20
Unknown
average ecommerce about 2%.

00;19;35;20 – 00;19;37;08
Unknown
So most people don’t,

00;19;37;08 – 00;19;41;22
Unknown
but most people obviously haven’t went through and simplified their site and cleaned it up and

00;19;41;22 – 00;19;44;06
Unknown
understand all the principles that we’re talking about here.

00;19;44;06 – 00;19;45;17
Unknown
So I would say

00;19;45;17 – 00;19;46;17
Unknown
I mean, let me just

00;19;46;17 – 00;19;47;23
Unknown
give another caveat.

00;19;47;23 – 00;19;49;17
Unknown
People go to Amazon to buy.

00;19;49;17 – 00;19;52;25
Unknown
They’re not going on like they know, hey, I need this. They go on

00;19;52;25 – 00;19;57;27
Unknown
and it’s basically they’re selecting a choice of which product they’re going to get to buy.

00;19;57;27 – 00;19;59;07
Unknown
They’re not going on there to

00;19;59;07 – 00;20;01;24
Unknown
like cost compare and all that other stuff. They go there to buy.

00;20;01;24 – 00;20;03;09
Unknown
They don’t do that with their store.

00;20;03;09 – 00;20;07;09
Unknown
They typically will visit two or three competitors, find out, you know,

00;20;07;09 – 00;20;08;03
Unknown
who they trust,

00;20;08;03 – 00;20;08;22
Unknown
who they like.

00;20;08;22 – 00;20;13;00
Unknown
Amazon has taken care of all of that for them. So they’re not doing that in that environment.

00;20;13;00 – 00;20;14;03
Unknown
So back to the

00;20;14;03 – 00;20;15;14
Unknown
back to the conversion.

00;20;15;14 – 00;20;19;18
Unknown
If you get up to about $100, then I would say,

00;20;19;18 – 00;20;21;21
Unknown
you know, 4% is really good.

00;20;21;21 – 00;20;22;22
Unknown
3%.

00;20;22;22 – 00;20;23;12
Unknown
Okay.

00;20;23;12 – 00;20;24;18
Unknown
Anything below that,

00;20;24;18 – 00;20;25;29
Unknown
you know, that you can improve that

00;20;25;29 – 00;20;27;06
Unknown
fairly significantly.

00;20;27;06 – 00;20;29;01
Unknown
And then about

00;20;29;01 – 00;20;30;09
Unknown
$150

00;20;30;09 – 00;20;33;23
Unknown
average order value, I would say that you should be converting

00;20;33;23 – 00;20;36;09
Unknown
should be converting at 3% would be really good

00;20;36;09 – 00;20;38;08
Unknown
to the two and a half would be

00;20;38;08 – 00;20;38;23
Unknown
okay.

00;20;38;23 – 00;20;41;29
Unknown
yeah, excellent answer. In your right, it was definitely a loaded question,

00;20;41;29 – 00;20;43;08
Unknown
but you navigated it well.

00;20;43;08 – 00;20;44;13
Unknown
Yeah, I think I

00;20;44;13 – 00;20;48;13
Unknown
would. I would I would love people to recognize is that traffic

00;20;48;13 – 00;20;49;15
Unknown
not their problem.

00;20;49;15 – 00;20;50;00
Unknown
So

00;20;50;00 – 00;20;52;01
Unknown
if your average ecommerce

00;20;52;01 – 00;20;52;25
Unknown
store

00;20;52;25 – 00;20;54;09
Unknown
converts around 2%.

00;20;54;09 – 00;20;56;28
Unknown
Most people are like, okay, how do I get more traffic?

00;20;56;28 – 00;21;00;07
Unknown
My thought processes there was 98 people

00;21;00;07 – 00;21;02;15
Unknown
that came to your site there, there typed it in

00;21;02;15 – 00;21;05;00
Unknown
or clicked on an ad and came there and laughed.

00;21;05;00 – 00;21;07;24
Unknown
If you get two more of those, you doubled your business.

00;21;07;24 – 00;21;08;09
Unknown
So

00;21;08;09 – 00;21;11;23
Unknown
why not do that first become a lot more profitable

00;21;11;23 – 00;21;15;11
Unknown
and then you can go buy more media than your competitors can and you win.

00;21;15;11 – 00;21;16;14
Unknown
Most people

00;21;16;14 – 00;21;17;28
Unknown
ignore the fact that

00;21;17;28 – 00;21;19;19
Unknown
if they spent more time

00;21;19;19 – 00;21;20;19
Unknown
fixing the site

00;21;20;19 – 00;21;21;04
Unknown
first

00;21;21;04 – 00;21;22;25
Unknown
and buying traffic second,

00;21;22;25 – 00;21;26;20
Unknown
they would be able to buy a lot more traffic and definitely a lot more than their competitors.

00;21;26;20 – 00;21;27;23
Unknown
I totally agree.

00;21;27;23 – 00;21;33;27
Unknown
And customer acquisition is usually is usually how you you beat your competitors anyway. And so if you can improve conversion rate,

00;21;33;27 – 00;21;36;08
Unknown
your customer acquisition gets easier. And so

00;21;36;08 – 00;21;37;03
Unknown
last question

00;21;37;03 – 00;21;38;13
Unknown
and you mentioned it a little bit, Matt

00;21;38;24 – 00;21;39;12
Unknown
Trust.

00;21;39;12 – 00;21;40;15
Unknown
And so you had mentioned,

00;21;40;15 – 00;21;42;02
Unknown
you know, Amazon has taken all that

00;21;42;02 – 00;21;42;20
Unknown
away.

00;21;42;22 – 00;21;47;20
Unknown
You don’t have to worry about it. When they go to Amazon, they’re there, they’re there to buy and they know I can trust Amazon.

00;21;47;20 – 00;21;50;00
Unknown
what can you do on a on your own ecommerce store

00;21;50;00 – 00;21;52;25
Unknown
to get customers to trust you? What are a couple of ways.

00;21;52;25 – 00;21;57;25
Unknown
So one is certainly reviews. Amazon has pioneered that whole system of reviews.

00;21;57;25 – 00;21;59;25
Unknown
We always encourage people.

00;21;59;25 – 00;22;01;19
Unknown
One of our best practices is

00;22;01;19 – 00;22;04;06
Unknown
to make your your review stars

00;22;04;06 – 00;22;05;12
Unknown
the Amazon yellow,

00;22;05;12 – 00;22;12;24
Unknown
because in your mind you automatically borrow their social proof of like all these are reviews stars. This is

00;22;12;24 – 00;22;13;28
Unknown
I feel comfortable

00;22;13;28 – 00;22;17;25
Unknown
when you try to make it blend in with the color and the theme.

00;22;17;25 – 00;22;20;23
Unknown
It doesn’t stand out as like, Oh, this is

00;22;20;23 – 00;22;25;01
Unknown
like Amazon, which is what you really do want it to, to seem like.

00;22;25;01 – 00;22;26;02
Unknown
The other thing

00;22;26;02 – 00;22;28;03
Unknown
that I was I meant to mention earlier

00;22;28;03 – 00;22;30;14
Unknown
when we were talking about different practices.

00;22;30;14 – 00;22;33;15
Unknown
I don’t make your button colors match your theme colors.

00;22;33;15 – 00;22;36;00
Unknown
A lot of people, if their site is purple,

00;22;36;00 – 00;22;37;09
Unknown
they make their button purple.

00;22;37;09 – 00;22;39;04
Unknown
Well, the problem with that is

00;22;39;04 – 00;22;40;27
Unknown
you want to always you want

00;22;40;27 – 00;22;46;17
Unknown
the button to be the next most valuable action that they perform, like they’re on your product page.

00;22;46;17 – 00;22;48;07
Unknown
You want them to hit the add to cart

00;22;48;07 – 00;22;51;05
Unknown
If they’re on the car, you want them to hit the proceed to checkout

00;22;51;05 – 00;22;52;00
Unknown
and so on.

00;22;52;00 – 00;22;52;17
Unknown
And so

00;22;52;17 – 00;22;56;21
Unknown
always make the button color different and everything else on the page

00;22;56;21 – 00;23;00;08
Unknown
because then it always stands out. So when I’m on the home page

00;23;00;08 – 00;23;03;25
Unknown
and I go to my category and I get my filter and then I go there,

00;23;03;25 – 00;23;08;16
Unknown
all those buttons should all be of the same color, but not match anything else on the site.

00;23;08;16 – 00;23;10;09
Unknown
And that kind of leads them through

00;23;10;09 – 00;23;11;04
Unknown
without them

00;23;11;04 – 00;23;12;14
Unknown
figuring out what to do.

00;23;12;14 – 00;23;14;11
Unknown
I like that. Is there a specific color that

00;23;14;11 – 00;23;15;06
Unknown
gets a higher

00;23;15;06 – 00;23;15;16
Unknown
click

00;23;15;16 – 00;23;16;01
Unknown
Now,

00;23;16;01 – 00;23;18;11
Unknown
the only thing that I can tell you that

00;23;18;11 – 00;23;21;00
Unknown
we’ve tested and it doesn’t work well is red,

00;23;21;00 – 00;23;25;14
Unknown
red online typically signifies there’s an error or stop.

00;23;25;14 – 00;23;25;25
Unknown
And

00;23;25;25 – 00;23;29;25
Unknown
so we tend to default a green because green just means go.

00;23;29;25 – 00;23;30;07
Unknown
And

00;23;30;07 – 00;23;31;08
Unknown
most people’s

00;23;31;08 – 00;23;32;20
Unknown
theme colors aren’t green.

00;23;32;20 – 00;23;34;12
Unknown
And so it stands out and it works.

00;23;34;12 – 00;23;38;13
Unknown
I really like that. I really like that. And I like that it’s tested in and

00;23;38;13 – 00;23;41;05
Unknown
delivered to our listeners. So thank you for that.

00;23;41;05 – 00;23;42;14
Unknown
one thing that

00;23;42;14 – 00;23;43;07
Unknown
is,

00;23;43;07 – 00;23;44;24
Unknown
as I think about this,

00;23;44;24 – 00;23;46;29
Unknown
one thing that would be helpful is

00;23;46;29 – 00;23;50;22
Unknown
maybe some examples of companies that do this really well.

00;23;50;22 – 00;23;54;12
Unknown
For instance, like when I’m communicating with our graphics department,

00;23;54;12 – 00;23;56;19
Unknown
I always like to point them in the direction of

00;23;56;19 – 00;23;57;09
Unknown
Anker

00;23;57;09 – 00;23;59;05
Unknown
Lululemon in dollar Shaped

00;23;59;05 – 00;24;03;03
Unknown
I really like those websites and from a graphic standpoint, they do an excellent job.

00;24;03;03 – 00;24;04;20
Unknown
And so do you have any

00;24;04;20 – 00;24;05;28
Unknown
examples of

00;24;05;28 – 00;24;06;20
Unknown
large

00;24;06;20 – 00;24;07;20
Unknown
brands that

00;24;07;20 – 00;24;09;11
Unknown
do a really good job here?

00;24;09;11 – 00;24;14;18
Unknown
I can I can give you an example of a product that we really like, and we worked with them,

00;24;14;18 – 00;24;17;22
Unknown
we work with them, and they do a really good job as ants and

00;24;17;22 – 00;24;18;03
Unknown
it’s

00;24;18;03 – 00;24;20;11
Unknown
literally my favorite belt I’ve ever worn.

00;24;20;11 – 00;24;23;01
Unknown
They do a phenomenal job. They have a lifetime warranty.

00;24;23;01 – 00;24;25;13
Unknown
It’s just a great product. And

00;24;25;13 – 00;24;27;17
Unknown
he continues to work on

00;24;27;17 – 00;24;31;05
Unknown
clarifying and making the site better, better and better. And it

00;24;31;05 – 00;24;32;19
Unknown
it uses all of the

00;24;32;19 – 00;24;34;10
Unknown
best practices that we talk about.

00;24;34;10 – 00;24;36;12
Unknown
Very nice And that was Anson Belt.

00;24;36;12 – 00;24;39;04
Unknown
Yep And so and the outcome

00;24;39;04 – 00;24;39;20
Unknown
awesome

00;24;39;20 – 00;24;40;14
Unknown
on that.

00;24;40;14 – 00;24;43;27
Unknown
So actually that is the perfect example for my next question

00;24;43;27 – 00;24;48;00
Unknown
on things that require an intermediate step like measuring,

00;24;48;00 – 00;24;48;26
Unknown
for instance, like

00;24;48;26 – 00;24;50;20
Unknown
is this belt going to fit me?

00;24;50;20 – 00;24;54;26
Unknown
Oh, I need to get up for my computer, I need to go get a cloth tape, which I don’t have

00;24;54;26 – 00;24;56;23
Unknown
because no one sews these days

00;24;56;23 – 00;24;58;16
Unknown
and measure measure my waist.

00;24;58;16 – 00;25;05;17
Unknown
what’s the best way to address that? Where where there’s an intermediate step that would require like measuring or something like that?

00;25;05;17 – 00;25;09;21
Unknown
the good thing is that belt doesn’t require measuring because you actually trim it. Once you get it

00;25;09;21 – 00;25;12;20
Unknown
it’s actually really cool. So when you go to the home page,

00;25;12;20 – 00;25;13;13
Unknown
will be

00;25;13;13 – 00;25;17;09
Unknown
a couple little caveats right underneath the hero image.

00;25;17;09 – 00;25;19;15
Unknown
And what they say is see how.

00;25;19;15 – 00;25;23;17
Unknown
And so what we did is we take a poll of all their customers

00;25;23;17 – 00;25;25;00
Unknown
and ask them what was

00;25;25;00 – 00;25;25;21
Unknown
what was

00;25;25;21 – 00;25;29;05
Unknown
a friction point or what was one thing that almost kept you from buying.

00;25;29;05 – 00;25;32;03
Unknown
And when we got all those answers and we tabulated,

00;25;32;03 – 00;25;33;28
Unknown
we ended up going and

00;25;33;28 – 00;25;35;06
Unknown
answering those

00;25;35;06 – 00;25;39;15
Unknown
on that home page, like one size fits all that confused a lot of people.

00;25;39;15 – 00;25;40;29
Unknown
How can one size fits all?

00;25;40;29 – 00;25;44;04
Unknown
While it’s because when you trim it and you put it into the buckle,

00;25;44;04 – 00;25;46;21
Unknown
it’s a ratchet belt. And so it has

00;25;46;21 – 00;25;50;05
Unknown
every quarter inch. It’s micro adjustable, so there’s no holes in it.

00;25;50;05 – 00;25;52;08
Unknown
So it’s always the right size.

00;25;52;08 – 00;25;52;24
Unknown
But

00;25;52;24 – 00;25;57;26
Unknown
people then, you know, without me explaining that, how do you do that on a website while we put a little

00;25;57;26 – 00;25;58;24
Unknown
see how

00;25;58;24 – 00;26;03;01
Unknown
they click it, a little window comes up and he plays a video showing how you trim it and

00;26;03;01 – 00;26;04;19
Unknown
size fits one size fits all.

00;26;04;19 – 00;26;05;19
Unknown
And he does that with

00;26;05;19 – 00;26;07;02
Unknown
multiple different things.

00;26;07;02 – 00;26;10;27
Unknown
So essentially what you have to do, again, go back to that Homer Simpson,

00;26;10;27 – 00;26;13;11
Unknown
you understand what you’re describing

00;26;13;11 – 00;26;14;16
Unknown
as the seller.

00;26;14;16 – 00;26;17;12
Unknown
Go go to your page and look at it as a buyer

00;26;17;12 – 00;26;22;13
Unknown
and be like, okay, am I going to actually understand this or is it going to confuse me?

00;26;22;13 – 00;26;24;03
Unknown
I always say that the reason

00;26;24;03 – 00;26;25;22
Unknown
someone types in your site,

00;26;25;22 – 00;26;26;19
Unknown
they come to it

00;26;26;19 – 00;26;31;19
Unknown
and then they don’t buy is they either one don’t trust you or two, they have an unanswered question.

00;26;31;19 – 00;26;34;05
Unknown
And the problem is most people

00;26;34;05 – 00;26;37;03
Unknown
are raising questions in their customers mind

00;26;37;03 – 00;26;38;13
Unknown
without answering them.

00;26;38;13 – 00;26;40;00
Unknown
And so when they do that,

00;26;40;00 – 00;26;44;05
Unknown
the person then goes, Oh, I need to find out more information before I can make a purchase

00;26;44;05 – 00;26;46;28
Unknown
instead of leading them through the sale.

00;26;46;28 – 00;26;48;10
Unknown
You know, if you’re trying to say

00;26;48;10 – 00;26;50;08
Unknown
quick add to card on the home page,

00;26;50;08 – 00;26;53;27
Unknown
let me ask you a question like and you see it all the time, even on big sites.

00;26;53;27 – 00;26;57;03
Unknown
Do you have enough information on that product to make

00;26;57;03 – 00;26;58;11
Unknown
a buying decision

00;26;58;11 – 00;27;00;18
Unknown
when it’s a quick ad on the home page?

00;27;00;18 – 00;27;04;02
Unknown
Unless you’re a returning visitor, which is only it should only be about

00;27;04;02 – 00;27;05;25
Unknown
30% of your customers,

00;27;05;25 – 00;27;06;28
Unknown
then know

00;27;06;28 – 00;27;08;15
Unknown
if you’re buying in traffic,

00;27;08;15 – 00;27;12;18
Unknown
you know, 30% returning is good because you’re always sending new people there.

00;27;12;18 – 00;27;13;08
Unknown
But if

00;27;13;08 – 00;27;16;06
Unknown
a lot of those things like people don’t understand,

00;27;16;06 – 00;27;18;22
Unknown
you’re when you say quick add to cart,

00;27;18;22 – 00;27;19;05
Unknown
that’s

00;27;19;05 – 00;27;23;00
Unknown
seller, a store owner trying to get someone to make a buy that’s not

00;27;23;00 – 00;27;24;08
Unknown
a customer going,

00;27;24;08 – 00;27;27;14
Unknown
Oh, I want to make this decision with no information. Yeah, I’ll do that.

00;27;27;14 – 00;27;28;05
Unknown
I like that.

00;27;28;05 – 00;27;30;25
Unknown
My lesson last question here is

00;27;30;25 – 00;27;31;14
Unknown
mobile.

00;27;31;14 – 00;27;33;12
Unknown
Lot of people are shopping on mobile

00;27;33;12 – 00;27;36;10
Unknown
it seems like when we’re laying out websites, we’re often

00;27;36;10 – 00;27;39;06
Unknown
looking at it from the perspective of

00;27;39;06 – 00;27;40;24
Unknown
desktop user. And so

00;27;40;24 – 00;27;43;25
Unknown
are there any special considerations or things

00;27;43;25 – 00;27;46;20
Unknown
they’re pro tips that you have on optimizing

00;27;46;20 – 00;27;49;02
Unknown
a website for both mobile and desktop?

00;27;49;02 – 00;27;49;25
Unknown
Yeah, the

00;27;49;25 – 00;27;52;26
Unknown
the one we already talked about is labeling everything.

00;27;52;26 – 00;27;54;22
Unknown
So on mobile, you have

00;27;54;22 – 00;27;57;14
Unknown
obviously a lot less real estate. And I could tell you

00;27;57;14 – 00;27;59;02
Unknown
the metric that we use

00;27;59;02 – 00;27;59;17
Unknown
is

00;27;59;17 – 00;28;02;12
Unknown
desktop will convert twice as high as your mobile.

00;28;02;12 – 00;28;09;12
Unknown
So if your mobile is converting at 3%, your desktop should convert at 6% or something’s broken with that.

00;28;09;12 – 00;28;12;08
Unknown
And tablet is the same as desktop.

00;28;12;08 – 00;28;12;26
Unknown
So not

00;28;12;26 – 00;28;16;02
Unknown
mobile and tablet, it’s mobile, which is a phone,

00;28;16;02 – 00;28;20;03
Unknown
and then desktop and tablets and desktop and tablet will convert twice as high.

00;28;20;03 – 00;28;24;12
Unknown
using those metrics, you can see if one is underperforming or

00;28;24;12 – 00;28;25;25
Unknown
are not performing well or not.

00;28;25;25 – 00;28;26;25
Unknown
As far as

00;28;26;25 – 00;28;27;13
Unknown
traffic,

00;28;27;13 – 00;28;29;11
Unknown
I would say if you don’t have

00;28;29;11 – 00;28;31;07
Unknown
an entire team to help you with that,

00;28;31;07 – 00;28;32;11
Unknown
I would almost

00;28;32;11 – 00;28;33;15
Unknown
I would certainly neglect

00;28;33;15 – 00;28;34;23
Unknown
desktop first,

00;28;34;23 – 00;28;37;25
Unknown
because 80% of your traffic nowadays is mobile.

00;28;37;25 – 00;28;39;24
Unknown
When we first started this ten years ago,

00;28;39;24 – 00;28;42;22
Unknown
it was 80% was desktop, 20% was mobile.

00;28;42;22 – 00;28;46;13
Unknown
And now it is literally almost exactly flat. In fact,

00;28;46;13 – 00;28;47;07
Unknown
I would say that

00;28;47;07 – 00;28;51;00
Unknown
tends to be about 83%, 84% mobile now

00;28;51;00 – 00;28;52;13
Unknown
instead of 8020. But

00;28;52;13 – 00;28;53;16
Unknown
so for sure,

00;28;53;16 – 00;28;57;13
Unknown
that’s where you need to focus if you have an entire team, then then you can

00;28;57;13 – 00;29;01;11
Unknown
kind of take what’s working on mobile and figure out a way to do it on desktop.

00;29;01;11 – 00;29;04;06
Unknown
But you have so much more real estate on desktop to work with.

00;29;04;06 – 00;29;06;28
Unknown
You don’t to worry nearly as much about things being perfect.

00;29;06;28 – 00;29;10;14
Unknown
it’s kind of an amazing stat. And what you mentioned earlier, Matt was

00;29;10;14 – 00;29;10;27
Unknown
like,

00;29;10;27 – 00;29;11;29
Unknown
there’s so much left,

00;29;11;29 – 00;29;13;03
Unknown
there’s so much growth left

00;29;13;03 – 00;29;16;27
Unknown
in e-commerce penetration. It feels like we’re in like inning two or three.

00;29;16;27 – 00;29;18;04
Unknown
Yeah, And so we have

00;29;18;04 – 00;29;20;21
Unknown
yeah, we’re like, we’re in a good space, right? And so

00;29;20;21 – 00;29;25;12
Unknown
yeah, 80% of sales you’re seeing coming from mobile, that’s, that’s pretty incredible. So it’s like

00;29;25;12 – 00;29;26;07
Unknown
with what we’re,

00;29;26;07 – 00;29;32;29
Unknown
we’re kind of sharing with our team is designed for mobile and just make sure desktop works. And so just like what you just said and so

00;29;32;29 – 00;29;33;13
Unknown
like that.

00;29;33;13 – 00;29;33;22
Unknown
So

00;29;33;22 – 00;29;36;08
Unknown
moving on a little bit of a deeper question here

00;29;36;08 – 00;29;38;10
Unknown
can you define customer segmentation

00;29;38;10 – 00;29;39;21
Unknown
and then can you

00;29;39;21 – 00;29;41;08
Unknown
share with the audience like

00;29;41;08 – 00;29;42;10
Unknown
is this something you would

00;29;42;10 – 00;29;44;21
Unknown
recommend doing in only if you had

00;29;44;21 – 00;29;46;26
Unknown
paid media organic traffic?

00;29;46;26 – 00;29;48;09
Unknown
Can you dive into that a little bit?

00;29;48;09 – 00;29;49;17
Unknown
Yeah. So

00;29;49;17 – 00;29;52;10
Unknown
it depends on how much data you have

00;29;52;10 – 00;29;58;11
Unknown
typically, the brands that we that we’re working on personally have a lot of data and then in our membership,

00;29;58;11 – 00;30;00;06
Unknown
those are the smaller stores that are

00;30;00;06 – 00;30;02;09
Unknown
benefiting from what we need to grow.

00;30;02;09 – 00;30;05;27
Unknown
The, the more data you have, the better. I would segment

00;30;05;27 – 00;30;06;23
Unknown
your data by

00;30;06;23 – 00;30;08;28
Unknown
how many times someone has bought from you.

00;30;08;28 – 00;30;12;22
Unknown
So people have bought five or more people about four or more, three or more.

00;30;12;22 – 00;30;15;25
Unknown
Each one of those is it is a different level of

00;30;15;25 – 00;30;16;13
Unknown
fan

00;30;16;13 – 00;30;19;20
Unknown
and so you can treat them differently and you can

00;30;19;20 – 00;30;22;18
Unknown
ask the people that have bought from you five or more times

00;30;22;18 – 00;30;23;27
Unknown
great questions

00;30;23;27 – 00;30;24;28
Unknown
that will help you

00;30;24;28 – 00;30;26;14
Unknown
make your site work better.

00;30;26;14 – 00;30;27;09
Unknown
One of the

00;30;27;09 – 00;30;28;27
Unknown
actually, I’m going to give you a little nugget

00;30;28;27 – 00;30;30;11
Unknown
and then I’ll go back to this.

00;30;30;11 – 00;30;37;05
Unknown
I would tell you that one of the smartest things that we’ve ever done is put a little survey on the thank you paid

00;30;37;05 – 00;30;38;21
Unknown
that asks the question,

00;30;38;21 – 00;30;41;29
Unknown
what is one thing that almost made you not by

00;30;41;29 – 00;30;46;04
Unknown
And what happens is all the people that just spent money with you

00;30;46;04 – 00;30;49;21
Unknown
will answer Oh wow, this or oh, well, that, right?

00;30;49;21 – 00;30;50;28
Unknown
This wasn’t clear.

00;30;50;28 – 00;30;52;07
Unknown
And when you do that,

00;30;52;07 – 00;30;57;11
Unknown
they are telling you what to go work on on their website in order to make more sales.

00;30;57;11 – 00;31;01;15
Unknown
And some of our largest wins on the majority of our sites

00;31;01;15 – 00;31;05;02
Unknown
come from the answers there, because those are your buyers

00;31;05;02 – 00;31;08;04
Unknown
they’re telling you what was hard for them to understand or what was

00;31;08;04 – 00;31;09;03
Unknown
a friction point.

00;31;09;03 – 00;31;10;19
Unknown
So now going back to

00;31;10;19 – 00;31;11;20
Unknown
how you segment,

00;31;11;20 – 00;31;17;28
Unknown
you can ask them questions and you can treat them differently. One of the things that I notice is,

00;31;17;28 – 00;31;20;17
Unknown
oh, we’ll give our first time buyers 10% off

00;31;20;17 – 00;31;21;10
Unknown
to me.

00;31;21;10 – 00;31;25;02
Unknown
I think in my head, if I’m a customer and I come back

00;31;25;02 – 00;31;25;28
Unknown
and I see that

00;31;25;28 – 00;31;29;13
Unknown
I’ve already bought from you, why are you not giving me 10% off?

00;31;29;13 – 00;31;33;22
Unknown
you’re willing to give that to a stranger, but not someone I’m coming back to buy again?

00;31;33;22 – 00;31;34;08
Unknown
So they

00;31;34;08 – 00;31;38;15
Unknown
were doing things different or finding a better way to offer

00;31;38;15 – 00;31;39;07
Unknown
discounts.

00;31;39;07 – 00;31;43;12
Unknown
I would much rather give the discount to the person that’s five or more times

00;31;43;12 – 00;31;44;21
Unknown
than the first time buyer.

00;31;44;21 – 00;31;45;25
Unknown
you could say,

00;31;45;25 – 00;31;46;23
Unknown
free shipping

00;31;46;23 – 00;31;48;02
Unknown
on your first purchase.

00;31;48;02 – 00;31;50;24
Unknown
Then you haven’t devalued the cost of your product,

00;31;50;24 – 00;31;52;28
Unknown
but you given them an incentive

00;31;52;28 – 00;31;53;25
Unknown
that doesn’t say,

00;31;53;25 – 00;31;59;27
Unknown
Hey, we’re just going to mark mark down our profit because we have it and it’s already baked in there for us to do that.

00;31;59;27 – 00;32;02;04
Unknown
So there’s a lot of different things that you can do.

00;32;02;04 – 00;32;05;05
Unknown
during that segmentation, I would actually treat

00;32;05;05 – 00;32;06;22
Unknown
each level of customer

00;32;06;22 – 00;32;10;28
Unknown
better than the previous one, or I’d give them more options to do business with Deal.

00;32;10;28 – 00;32;11;25
Unknown
I really like that

00;32;11;25 – 00;32;17;02
Unknown
in-house. We do. I think it’s five or more purchases. We segment into a VIP club

00;32;17;02 – 00;32;19;28
Unknown
and we and we treat them different. We give them different coupons and stuff.

00;32;19;28 – 00;32;24;24
Unknown
bet if you look and see what the customer is from that VIP club

00;32;24;24 – 00;32;28;02
Unknown
rank as far as like what percentage of your income

00;32;28;02 – 00;32;29;11
Unknown
from the entire site,

00;32;29;11 – 00;32;32;25
Unknown
it’s so astronomically bigger than your first time users

00;32;32;25 – 00;32;34;20
Unknown
the mentality that people have.

00;32;34;20 – 00;32;37;02
Unknown
Yes, you always need to be putting new ones in there,

00;32;37;02 – 00;32;40;22
Unknown
not at the expense of the people that continue to come back and buy from you.

00;32;40;22 – 00;32;42;13
Unknown
treat those people really good.

00;32;42;13 – 00;32;44;06
Unknown
That’s your highest profit margin,

00;32;44;06 – 00;32;45;19
Unknown
your first time customers.

00;32;45;19 – 00;32;47;10
Unknown
Most time you’re breaking even on a

00;32;47;10 – 00;32;50;27
Unknown
yeah. Especially if you’re if you’re driving, you know, if you’re paid paid media and so

00;32;50;27 – 00;32;52;08
Unknown
cost of customer acquisition.

00;32;52;08 – 00;32;56;28
Unknown
And so keeping those lifetime customers, you know, you’re just increasing the lifetime value.

00;32;56;28 – 00;33;02;04
Unknown
you know, one thing that you mention is what something we’re not doing. I was feverishly writing down here.

00;33;02;04 – 00;33;11;11
Unknown
We’re not doing that on the Thank you page, which we’re going to be doing that soon. And then also on our VIP emails, we’re not asking them questions which those they have.

00;33;11;11 – 00;33;14;19
Unknown
The most experience on our site checking out and shopping. So

00;33;14;19 – 00;33;17;02
Unknown
when you create a form and send it out to the VIPs,

00;33;17;02 – 00;33;18;22
Unknown
what could we do? What can we do better

00;33;18;22 – 00;33;21;29
Unknown
and get that operation because they have the most experience purchasing, right?

00;33;21;29 – 00;33;22;27
Unknown
Yeah. And

00;33;22;27 – 00;33;23;18
Unknown
think about

00;33;23;18 – 00;33;28;08
Unknown
the referral that someone who’s bought from you four times, five times

00;33;28;08 – 00;33;28;29
Unknown
already

00;33;28;29 – 00;33;30;27
Unknown
compared to someone that

00;33;30;27 – 00;33;33;23
Unknown
you know, first time on your site or second time on their site.

00;33;33;23 – 00;33;36;17
Unknown
So having some sort of incentive

00;33;36;17 – 00;33;40;08
Unknown
for your superfans to tell other people about it

00;33;40;08 – 00;33;44;17
Unknown
is a great idea, and they’ll love to do it because they’re already comfortable.

00;33;44;17 – 00;33;46;01
Unknown
So they get social

00;33;46;01 – 00;33;48;29
Unknown
capital with their friends because they included

00;33;48;29 – 00;33;52;00
Unknown
a brand that they know like and trust and they told their friends about it.

00;33;52;00 – 00;33;52;20
Unknown
Awesome.

00;33;52;20 – 00;33;56;14
Unknown
as we’ve gone through this interview, Matthew, I’m starting to think of you as

00;33;56;14 – 00;33;57;24
Unknown
a website doctor,

00;33;57;24 – 00;33;59;08
Unknown
I’m going to make an analogy here.

00;33;59;08 – 00;34;01;13
Unknown
If you were to ask a pediatrician, like

00;34;01;13 – 00;34;04;01
Unknown
if you draw a pie chart of what people come in for,

00;34;04;01 – 00;34;08;01
Unknown
they’d probably say, okay, strep throat, The flu in a physical for school

00;34;08;01 – 00;34;09;06
Unknown
makes up 80%

00;34;09;06 – 00;34;10;27
Unknown
of why people come to see me.

00;34;10;27 – 00;34;14;23
Unknown
And so I think you’ve a really cool perspective in that you’re looking at

00;34;14;23 – 00;34;16;14
Unknown
you have a lot of patients, meaning

00;34;16;14 – 00;34;18;27
Unknown
you have a lot of websites that you’re looking at. So

00;34;18;27 – 00;34;20;14
Unknown
what would be those top three,

00;34;20;14 – 00;34;20;26
Unknown
four

00;34;20;26 – 00;34;24;20
Unknown
issues? When people come to you, you’re like, this is this is what’s wrong?

00;34;24;20 – 00;34;25;08
Unknown
Yeah,

00;34;25;08 – 00;34;25;26
Unknown
I think

00;34;25;26 – 00;34;27;17
Unknown
like I said, first off,

00;34;27;17 – 00;34;29;05
Unknown
going to it from the

00;34;29;05 – 00;34;30;08
Unknown
would say simplicity.

00;34;30;08 – 00;34;31;16
Unknown
So for sure,

00;34;31;16 – 00;34;32;24
Unknown
if you have

00;34;32;24 – 00;34;35;25
Unknown
a form that takes 30 pages to fill it out,

00;34;35;25 – 00;34;40;08
Unknown
you know, when you get there, how happy are you going to be by the time you see the doctor? You know, it’s just

00;34;40;08 – 00;34;41;01
Unknown
pain in the butt.

00;34;41;01 – 00;34;44;16
Unknown
And so if your site is a pain in the butt to work with or to

00;34;44;16 – 00;34;46;05
Unknown
find what they’re looking for,

00;34;46;05 – 00;34;47;24
Unknown
that’s that’s going to be an issue.

00;34;47;24 – 00;34;50;00
Unknown
So I think navigation is

00;34;50;00 – 00;34;50;13
Unknown
key.

00;34;50;13 – 00;34;54;14
Unknown
The second thing that really helps boost conversions

00;34;54;14 – 00;34;56;04
Unknown
is high quality pictures.

00;34;56;04 – 00;34;57;13
Unknown
So if they can

00;34;57;13 – 00;35;01;21
Unknown
see what they’re buying and it looks like a very good quality picture, they’re going to

00;35;01;21 – 00;35;04;17
Unknown
automatically trust and insinuate,

00;35;04;17 – 00;35;06;06
Unknown
okay, this is good quality.

00;35;06;06 – 00;35;08;27
Unknown
If if you have fuzzy pictures or

00;35;08;27 – 00;35;10;04
Unknown
you have way too many.

00;35;10;04 – 00;35;12;24
Unknown
So I go to a lot of sites where I see they have like

00;35;12;24 – 00;35;15;01
Unknown
30 thumbnails or 20 thumbnails

00;35;15;01 – 00;35;17;06
Unknown
and people think again, more is better.

00;35;17;06 – 00;35;22;01
Unknown
Actually what you’re doing is you’re hurting because they’re clicking on all these different thumbnails

00;35;22;01 – 00;35;23;22
Unknown
to think, Oh, what am I missing?

00;35;23;22 – 00;35;26;19
Unknown
what have I not seen? Why do I need to see so many?

00;35;26;19 – 00;35;27;20
Unknown
So have your product,

00;35;27;20 – 00;35;29;17
Unknown
maybe have a lifestyle shot of it,

00;35;29;17 – 00;35;31;02
Unknown
and then maybe some technical

00;35;31;02 – 00;35;32;18
Unknown
technical things about it that

00;35;32;18 – 00;35;34;24
Unknown
are unique value propositions?

00;35;34;24 – 00;35;35;27
Unknown
So between those

00;35;35;27 – 00;35;37;26
Unknown
that gives you the ability to one,

00;35;37;26 – 00;35;41;05
Unknown
it looks high quality to easy navigation.

00;35;41;05 – 00;35;41;19
Unknown
And

00;35;41;19 – 00;35;42;18
Unknown
probably

00;35;42;18 – 00;35;44;00
Unknown
the third one

00;35;44;00 – 00;35;48;01
Unknown
would be functionality like it’s amazing how many sites we go to

00;35;48;01 – 00;35;48;17
Unknown
and

00;35;48;17 – 00;35;52;11
Unknown
you hover over in the menu and also it covers up half the site or you

00;35;52;11 – 00;35;55;09
Unknown
click zoom and it’s like showing you the right shoulder.

00;35;55;09 – 00;35;57;06
Unknown
And when you try to move it around, like

00;35;57;06 – 00;35;59;19
Unknown
you can never get to the center where you’re trying to look

00;35;59;19 – 00;36;01;02
Unknown
and so a lot of times

00;36;01;02 – 00;36;01;23
Unknown
people,

00;36;01;23 – 00;36;04;23
Unknown
they’re looking at their site on desktop and it works great.

00;36;04;23 – 00;36;08;05
Unknown
But if they would go look at it on mobile, they would realize it’s horrendous.

00;36;08;05 – 00;36;09;23
Unknown
And so that’s the other thing.

00;36;09;23 – 00;36;13;29
Unknown
Stop checking your website on the desktop and start looking at it on your phone.

00;36;13;29 – 00;36;20;05
Unknown
got one. One last question. I know we could probably talk about this for a long time, but I definitely want to be respectful of your time. That and so

00;36;20;05 – 00;36;20;28
Unknown
last question

00;36;20;28 – 00;36;21;21
Unknown
that I have

00;36;21;21 – 00;36;28;12
Unknown
and this is in terms of like, I guess just your experience with working with clients, have you seen and this is also a loaded question,

00;36;28;12 – 00;36;29;17
Unknown
have you seen

00;36;29;17 – 00;36;30;16
Unknown
a better

00;36;30;16 – 00;36;31;06
Unknown
platforms?

00;36;31;06 – 00;36;32;17
Unknown
So people always say like,

00;36;32;17 – 00;36;42;05
Unknown
you know what platforms like So we have Wix, Shopify, WooCommerce, Magento, all of these platforms that you can, you can have your e-commerce ecommerce store on.

00;36;42;05 – 00;36;48;05
Unknown
Is there one that you recommend that you’ve worked with so many clients that maybe one one platform stands out that

00;36;48;05 – 00;36;50;05
Unknown
that just crushes it? Or is it’s easy to,

00;36;50;05 – 00;36;51;28
Unknown
you know, bring up conversion rates?

00;36;51;28 – 00;36;53;07
Unknown
What is your thoughts on that?

00;36;53;07 – 00;36;57;16
Unknown
Yeah, it’s it’s definitely Shopify. They’ve become the ¬£800 gorilla in the space. So

00;36;57;16 – 00;37;02;01
Unknown
we switch over a lot of large clients that were on like BigCommerce or WooCommerce

00;37;02;01 – 00;37;05;03
Unknown
and when we get them migrated on to Shopify

00;37;05;03 – 00;37;05;22
Unknown
even with

00;37;05;22 – 00;37;08;06
Unknown
identical say it will sell convert better

00;37;08;06 – 00;37;08;28
Unknown
the only

00;37;08;28 – 00;37;11;06
Unknown
reason why I could make that

00;37;11;06 – 00;37;14;01
Unknown
because essentially we have to make a hypothesis is why is that happen.

00;37;14;01 – 00;37;15;02
Unknown
It’s the same site.

00;37;15;02 – 00;37;15;29
Unknown
What’s going on?

00;37;15;29 – 00;37;17;15
Unknown
Well maybe it’s

00;37;17;15 – 00;37;19;27
Unknown
so many people have already purchased

00;37;19;27 – 00;37;20;27
Unknown
with the

00;37;20;27 – 00;37;22;21
Unknown
standard navigation of

00;37;22;21 – 00;37;24;28
Unknown
know add to cart proceed to checkout,

00;37;24;28 – 00;37;26;11
Unknown
enter your information and

00;37;26;11 – 00;37;27;13
Unknown
then you’re shipping and

00;37;27;13 – 00;37;29;02
Unknown
then complete the sale

00;37;29;02 – 00;37;29;16
Unknown
they’re

00;37;29;16 – 00;37;31;06
Unknown
comfortable with that process.

00;37;31;06 – 00;37;32;26
Unknown
And so when you have a different

00;37;32;26 – 00;37;33;18
Unknown
platform

00;37;33;18 – 00;37;35;27
Unknown
that’s customizable or different,

00;37;35;27 – 00;37;38;03
Unknown
they now have to think through the steps.

00;37;38;03 – 00;37;40;01
Unknown
And every time that you make them think

00;37;40;01 – 00;37;42;15
Unknown
that’s an access point, that’s a place where there’s friction.

00;37;42;15 – 00;37;43;07
Unknown
And so

00;37;43;07 – 00;37;45;00
Unknown
prototypical does matter.

00;37;45;00 – 00;37;49;27
Unknown
your menu navigation should be in the center and it should be moneymaking links,

00;37;49;27 – 00;37;50;08
Unknown
not

00;37;50;08 – 00;37;54;26
Unknown
about us. And, you know, all these other things that people put out their home button,

00;37;54;26 – 00;37;55;10
Unknown
you know,

00;37;55;10 – 00;37;56;29
Unknown
those things are all distracting.

00;37;57;00 – 00;37;59;11
Unknown
People know if they click on the logo, they’re going to go to the home.

00;37;59;11 – 00;38;00;29
Unknown
Having another home button.

00;38;00;29 – 00;38;04;28
Unknown
You’re literally giving rid of getting rid of some of your most valuable real estate,

00;38;04;28 – 00;38;06;22
Unknown
should be moneymaking links.

00;38;06;22 – 00;38;07;09
Unknown
And so

00;38;07;09 – 00;38;11;11
Unknown
Shopify has done a really good job of making things very simple,

00;38;11;11 – 00;38;11;24
Unknown
and

00;38;11;24 – 00;38;13;24
Unknown
their new 2.0 themes are great.

00;38;13;24 – 00;38;18;09
Unknown
Yeah, I would just say for sure if you’re getting started, Shopify is a great place to start.

00;38;18;09 – 00;38;20;26
Unknown
I like I do have one quick follow up question on that one.

00;38;20;26 – 00;38;29;22
Unknown
organic traffic, we focus a lot on organic traffic and we drive content and we drive social media all to our WordPress site and WordPress seems to work

00;38;29;22 – 00;38;31;17
Unknown
better with Google Analytics and ranking.

00;38;31;17 – 00;38;32;01
Unknown
And so

00;38;32;01 – 00;38;33;02
Unknown
in your experience of

00;38;33;02 – 00;38;35;18
Unknown
migrating clients from WordPress to Shopify,

00;38;35;18 – 00;38;37;27
Unknown
what happens to organic ranking and traffic?

00;38;37;27 – 00;38;38;24
Unknown
Organic traffic?

00;38;38;24 – 00;38;42;01
Unknown
Yeah, we’re word we have a quite a credit team,

00;38;42;01 – 00;38;45;24
Unknown
so we make sure that all the redirects are correct and doing that

00;38;45;24 – 00;38;46;22
Unknown
that is

00;38;46;22 – 00;38;49;16
Unknown
there is a certain amount that you will,

00;38;49;16 – 00;38;51;19
Unknown
it’ll drop off for a little bit and then come back.

00;38;51;19 – 00;38;55;04
Unknown
So yeah, you have to know that ahead of time and we let them know

00;38;55;04 – 00;38;56;15
Unknown
or you can just use

00;38;56;15 – 00;39;00;06
Unknown
your WordPress traffic and then direct them to your store.

00;39;00;06 – 00;39;06;20
Unknown
All right. For you to fire around, can you tell us a little bit more about build, grow, scale and what type of clients you like to work with?

00;39;06;20 – 00;39;10;01
Unknown
Yeah, so we actually have two parts of our business. One is

00;39;10;01 – 00;39;13;21
Unknown
where we partner with you and do all of the data,

00;39;13;21 – 00;39;19;15
Unknown
the split testing, the developer work, etc. and make the site grow and scale.

00;39;19;15 – 00;39;20;15
Unknown
You know, that’s really

00;39;20;15 – 00;39;21;28
Unknown
what those two metrics stand for.

00;39;21;28 – 00;39;24;21
Unknown
And then we have a membership that you can join that’s

00;39;24;21 – 00;39;25;14
Unknown
monthly

00;39;25;14 – 00;39;30;00
Unknown
and what you do in that group, it’s a Shopify store owners,

00;39;30;00 – 00;39;32;00
Unknown
the majority of them are Shopify store owners.

00;39;32;00 – 00;39;34;04
Unknown
We teach them what we’re doing

00;39;34;04 – 00;39;36;12
Unknown
and what’s working right now. So

00;39;36;12 – 00;39;37;11
Unknown
we’re using

00;39;37;11 – 00;39;39;26
Unknown
the principles and tactics that were

00;39;39;26 – 00;39;42;28
Unknown
finding on the larger brands and then sharing that

00;39;42;28 – 00;39;45;09
Unknown
in in the group of store owners that kind of,

00;39;45;09 – 00;39;46;26
Unknown
know, they really can’t have us.

00;39;46;26 – 00;39;49;23
Unknown
five guys on their team and spend the money to do that.

00;39;49;23 – 00;39;50;11
Unknown
And so

00;39;50;11 – 00;39;53;19
Unknown
a lot of times those store owners grow up

00;39;53;19 – 00;39;56;14
Unknown
and become our partners later on down the road.

00;39;56;14 – 00;40;00;07
Unknown
awesome. I like how you have a split between, you know, it’s kind of something for everyone, so

00;40;00;07 – 00;40;00;27
Unknown
that’s great.

00;40;00;27 – 00;40;02;23
Unknown
Okay. Matthew, are you ready for the fire around?

00;40;02;23 – 00;40;03;08
Unknown
Sure.

00;40;03;08 – 00;40;04;14
Unknown
What is your favorite book?

00;40;04;14 – 00;40;07;05
Unknown
Probably The Slight Edge by Jeff Olson.

00;40;07;05 – 00;40;07;22
Unknown
excellent.

00;40;07;22 – 00;40;08;20
Unknown
What are your hobbies?

00;40;08;20 – 00;40;10;02
Unknown
I like. I like to cycle.

00;40;10;02 – 00;40;11;08
Unknown
I definitely

00;40;11;08 – 00;40;14;27
Unknown
bear a lot of my life. I was into skydiving about 500 skydives

00;40;14;27 – 00;40;16;04
Unknown
and motorcycles.

00;40;16;04 – 00;40;16;25
Unknown
Okay.

00;40;16;25 – 00;40;18;04
Unknown
A thrill seeker. That’s awesome.

00;40;18;04 – 00;40;18;15
Unknown
Yeah.

00;40;18;15 – 00;40;19;07
Unknown
Yeah.

00;40;19;07 – 00;40;22;18
Unknown
What is one thing that you do not miss about working for the man?

00;40;22;18 – 00;40;26;12
Unknown
someone else telling me when I can take a vacation or not.

00;40;26;12 – 00;40;27;11
Unknown
That’s a great one.

00;40;27;11 – 00;40;30;03
Unknown
Last question. What do you think sets apart successful

00;40;30;03 – 00;40;33;29
Unknown
e-commerce entrepreneurs from those who give up, fail or never get started?

00;40;33;29 – 00;40;34;23
Unknown
Discipline.

00;40;34;23 – 00;40;38;21
Unknown
I would like in that to staying in shape and exercising.

00;40;38;21 – 00;40;41;10
Unknown
There’s a lot of days that I don’t feel like doing it,

00;40;41;10 – 00;40;44;23
Unknown
and if you do it anyways, those are the days that matter the most.

00;40;44;23 – 00;40;48;08
Unknown
And so the ones that I see that succeed

00;40;48;08 – 00;40;49;08
Unknown
have discipline

00;40;49;08 – 00;40;52;05
Unknown
and they follow that discipline rather than their failings,

00;40;52;05 – 00;40;52;23
Unknown
because

00;40;52;23 – 00;40;54;08
Unknown
we never say, Hey,

00;40;54;08 – 00;40;56;22
Unknown
you know, do this and you’re going to make a million bucks

00;40;56;22 – 00;40;59;12
Unknown
because there’s a lot of to do this that you have to do.

00;40;59;12 – 00;41;02;24
Unknown
And so you just have to have the daily discipline to do it.

00;41;02;24 – 00;41;05;04
Unknown
And that’s what’s going to make it successful over time.

00;41;05;04 – 00;41;06;03
Unknown
Excellent advice,

00;41;06;03 – 00;41;09;21
Unknown
Yeah. And if people are interested in working with Bill Grow

00;41;09;21 – 00;41;10;12
Unknown
scale,

00;41;10;12 – 00;41;11;29
Unknown
what would be the best way to get in contact?

00;41;11;29 – 00;41;13;10
Unknown
Bill GROSS gmail.com.

00;41;13;10 – 00;41;16;14
Unknown
Or they can email me at MAD at Bill GROSS, Qualcomm.

00;41;16;14 – 00;41;19;25
Unknown
Awesome. And we will post links to both of those in the show notes.

00;41;19;25 – 00;41;21;29
Unknown
Matthew, want to thank you for being a guest on the Firing Me

00;41;21;29 – 00;41;23;28
Unknown
podcast and looking forward to staying in touch.

00;41;23;28 – 00;41;25;10
Unknown
Yeah, sounds good. Thanks, guys.